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Darth Avlectus 02-13-2012 03:59 AM

Forms discussion
 
One thing I am noticing more of is talk of forms for different classes. I'm sure there are forms for most if not all classes and not just the lightsaber wielders. So I am starting this thread about it so that people not in the know (such as newcomers, like myself) about them relating to this MMO can be educated about them.

Some general questions:
Are they minor or do they have a significant impact on gameplay? How do they affect character development? Is it important to switch forms to match a given situation or is it pretty much a buff/debuff that is set-it-and-forget-it? Play styles--what fits where? Experience on personal levels matter, so what is important for newcomers to know? What techniques do experts use? What character progression is best suited to what?

Obviously this is not absolute criteria. Emphasize what you believe is important. Do go into your experiences and feel free to compare and point out specifics as well as generalized stuff about the various forms.

So I guess this could be considered an "Idiot's guide to SWTOR Forms" of a sort.

DarthParametric 02-13-2012 08:12 AM

Here is what I posted in the other thread -

Sith Warrior/Jedi Knight lightsaber forms:

Shii-Cho Form - Enter a balanced lightsaber form, increasing all damage dealt and reducing all damage received by 3%.
This is the base stance all Sith Warriors/Jedi Knights start with.

Ataru Form - Enters an acrobatic lightsaber form. Saber attacks will trigger an extra attack against a second enemy in melee range for 1 damage every 1.5 seconds. Also increases movement speed by 15%, and reduces the cooldown of Force Charge by 5 seconds. Benefits from dual wield.
This is the base Marauder/Sentinel AC DPS stance.

Juyo Form - Enters an aggressive lightsaber form, causing your melee attacks to increase all damage dealt by 2% for 15 seconds. Stacks up to 5 times. This effect cannot occur more than once every 1.5 seconds.
This is an additional Marauder/Sentinel AC DPS stance.

Soresu Form - Enters a defensive lightsaber form, reducing all damage taken by 6%, increasing armor rating by 60% and increasing threat generation by 50%. Soresu Form also increases shield chance by 20%. While active, taking damage builds 1 rage, but all Assault abilities generate 1 less rage. This effect cannot occur more than once every 6 seconds.
This is the Juggernaut/Guardian AC tanking stance.

Shien Form - Enters an aggressive lightsaber form, increasing all damage dealt by 6%. All attacks that cost rage will refund 1 rage when used. In addition, you generate 1 rage when attacked, but this effect cannot occur more than once every 6 seconds.
This is a Juggernaut/Guardian AC DPS stance that has to be spec'd into via the appropriate DPS tree.

Bounty Hunter/Trooper gas/ammo types:

Combustible Gas Cylinder/Plasma Cell - Loads your blaster with combustible gas, giving all of your blaster attacks a 10% chance to deal [?] additional elemental damage over 6 seconds.
The base DOT DPS stance for BHs/Troopers. The bonus damage improves with increased levels of the talent.

High Velocity Gas Cylinder/Armor Piercing Cell - Loads your blaster with a high velocity gas cylinder. While active, armor penetration is increased by 35%.
The burst DPS stance for BHs/Troopers.

Ion Gas Cylinder/Ion Cell - Loads your blaster with ion-charged gas, giving ranged attacks a chance to deal [?] additional energy damage. While this cylinder is active threat generated is increased by 50%. Increases armor by 60%, decreases all damage taken by 5% and increases shield chance by 20%.
This is the tanking stance for Powertech/Vanguard ACs.

High Energy Gas Cylinder/High Energy Cell - Loads your blaster with a high-energy gas cylinder. While active, all internal and elemental damage dealt is increased by 5%.
This is the DPS stance for Powertech/Vanguard ACs.

Combat Support Cylinder/Combat Support Cell - While active, Rapid Shots charges your powercell with each use. Charges increase all damage and healing dealt, up to a maximum of 3% at 30 charges. In addition, targeting an ally with Rapid Shots will heal the target for 100% of your tech bonus healing.
This is the healing stance for the Mercenary/Commando ACs.

Basically for these classes you would pick a stance and go with it pretty much. The exception might be a hybrid Mercenary/Commando that is switching between healing and DPS, but generally you spec into a tree that only takes advantage of a single stance and ties it to your main abilities, so switching stances would be detrimental (in some cases extremely so). The choice is really made for you when you select your particular tree of interest in your AC.

Additionally, Assassins/Shadows can switch between stealth and combat "stances", although I wouldn't really consider them stances as such.

Lynk Former 02-13-2012 08:51 AM

Also note that if you're a Vanguard/Powertech, your Ion Cell/Ion Gas Cylinder will activate the use of your equipped shield, giving you extra benefits from that. If you switch to another type such as High Energy Cell/High Energy Gas Cylinder then your shield which is equipped as an offhand weapon will basically becoming useless and won't provide you with any of the extra defensive stats such as shield rating and absorption rating.

DarthParametric 02-13-2012 09:05 AM

Presumably the only time you'd not use Ion Gas Cylinder/Ion Cell is if you were spec'd into one of the DPS trees, in which case you'd be using one of the DPS cylinders/cells and a Generator instead. The same would apply for a Juggernaut/Guardian, switching from Soresu to Shii-Cho/Shien.

mimartin 02-13-2012 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darth Avlectus (Post 2804330)
So I guess this could be considered an "Idiot's guide to SWTOR Forms" of a sort.

Play Smuggler or Agent, they are idiot proof when it comes to SWTOR Forms...says the person playing Smuggler and Agent. :xp:

ChAiNz.2da 02-13-2012 12:39 PM

Only thing I can attest to is that Juyo is going to be the last thing your enemy sees if you spec in the Annihilate tree ;) Just plain brutal and I almost feel bad for using it on my enemies. I swear I can see pixelated tears...

It's not as "instant" as I'd like but with the combination of bleeding, and the stack damage that Juyo builds... it's well built for the tougher elite/champion enemies (ones you have to wear down thousands of hit points). Just make sure to bring a healer (Quinn) or spec in END/STR rather than STR/END if you prefer Vette's 'instant' dps damage.

I've a newfound respect for Quinn, and I honestly have to say I take him with me moreso than Vette BECAUSE of the Juyo Form (most effective in Annihilate tree). 'Over time' damage doesn't lend well to squishy aggro-stealing Vettes.. hehe

DarthParametric 02-13-2012 01:01 PM

I would think the other tree and Ataru would be more suitable for general PVE (i.e. groups of trash mobs). Juyo and DOTs are really for single targets like Elites, as you say. Should be a useful build for heroics and Flashpoints.

ChAiNz.2da 02-13-2012 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarthParametric (Post 2804357)
I would think the other tree and Ataru would be more suitable for general PVE (i.e. groups of trash mobs). Juyo and DOTs are really for single targets like Elites, as you say. Should be a useful build for heroics and Flashpoints.

That's what I'm thinking now that I've got a taste of it (Juyo/Annihilate). Really enjoying it though, so I doubt I'll change the current build I'm working towards.

You're right about FP/Heroics.. I've solo'ed most of the Heroics and a few FP with the build (granted I was over-leveled by 2-3+) but it's quite possible as long as you invest in some HPs and let Quinn tagalong for those missions. :D

Lynk Former 02-13-2012 07:19 PM

@ DP: Well yeah, obviously... but I was just pointing out that the Ion cell and Shield Generator is unique in the way that it activates the use of the Shield Rating and Absorption Rating stats while the Power Generator doesn't actually add any extra stat modifiers and doesn't require the use of any any cell type to use.

DarthParametric 02-13-2012 10:07 PM

I would think that is because unlike Juggernauts/Guardians who really have to spec into a proper DPS form, Powertechs/Vanguards get both BH/Trooper DPS forms out of the gate. I guess they had to put some mechanic in there to stop them from being overpowered (especially hybrid builds).

On the subject of tanks, what is the deal with Assassin/Shadow tanks? Do they have some sort of equivalent to forms? Or do they just spec into passive tanking talents in their appropriate tree?

Darth Avlectus 03-13-2012 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarthParametric (Post 2804409)
On the subject of tanks, what is the deal with Assassin/Shadow tanks? Do they have some sort of equivalent to forms? Or do they just spec into passive tanking talents in their appropriate tree?

I've looked at TOR head, and nothing to the best I can tell, just double bladed lightsaber proficiency. FWIW it (double bladed) has been considered something a form all its own, morethan just variant. Though it may not qualify as a "form" per se in terms of game mechanics or stance in TOR.

Bummer, because that might be interesting to see Assassins using lightsaber forms like sith warriors, and more than just Shii-Cho. Ataru at a bare minimum, though Darth Maul supposedly used Juyo in EU lore, but according to Lynk's posti n a different thread about Ataru, it seems to behave similarly to Juyo of TSL (kill as fast as possible), where Juyo in this game behaves more like a cross between Niman and Makashi of TSL (hard hitting effects but doing damage over time overwhelming enemies).
As best I can tell from descriptions and accounts of gameplay.

There looks like plenty of nasty attacks, but I would have thought a berserk flurry might have made an appearance.

Shien...doesn't seem to be anything like in TSL at all, and I can't tell much about Soresu or Shii-Cho.

In TSL they were buffers and were not necessarily essential (I have seen vids where players ignore them and leave it on shii-cho all the time). How crucial to gameplay are they now?


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