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-   -   Dragon Age III: Inquisition (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=210687)

Alkonium 09-17-2012 11:48 AM

Dragon Age III: Inquisition
 
Link
No real story details, but I'm betting on Orlais. Cautiously optimistic so far.

mimartin 09-17-2012 12:02 PM

Looking forward to it, of course I was one of the few that enjoyed DA2. By the statement it sounded to me like they are distancing themselves from DA2 and this game will be more like DA:O. I don’t care either way, I liked both games.

Q 09-17-2012 12:32 PM

Both DAs are pretty much one-playthrough games, sort of like the ME series, but that one playthrough is usually worth the time spent.

Usually.

mr_dad 09-18-2012 02:28 PM

I loved Dragon Age Origins. I didn't love DA2 but it was still a fun game. So I am certainly looking forward to DA3. Only thing is, for every DAO save i had that i want to import, I have to play through DA2. Hopefully it'll be worth.

leXX 09-19-2012 11:17 AM

I absolutely loved DAO, wasn't keen on DA2 but I'll still buy and am looking forward to DA3. I certainly hope they are taking all the criticism about 2 seriously and are making it more like Origins like they say they are.

The Doctor 09-19-2012 11:30 AM

I found Dragon Age: Origins supremely disappointing. Haven't bothered with the second game yet.

Red Hessian 09-20-2012 05:49 PM

Loved DAO, loathed DA2.

Regarding DA3, going in with a deeply pessimistic view, but hoping I'll be surprised.

Q 09-20-2012 10:20 PM

Still trying to figure out what was so different about DA2 that made people hate it so much when compared to DA:O. :giveup:

Alkonium 09-20-2012 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Q (Post 2819373)
Still trying to figure out what was so different about DA2 that made people hate it so much when compared to DA:O. :giveup:

In fairness, Dragon Age II did feel like a radical departure from Origins. That being said, I personally found that Origins' visual style felt too reminiscent of Lord of the Rings, or generic fantasy, while Dragon Age II felt much more like its own thing. In addition, Dragon Age II's story seemed to revolve more around people than fighting ancient evil.

Dread Advocate 09-20-2012 10:46 PM

I'm going to take all this neutrally for now. I really enjoyed Origins, and was slightly disappointed with II, but I don't hate it. Once more information is revealed, I'll take a stance. There are, however, rumors that they'll be implementing mulitplayer into it. I won't care so long as they don't make it affect the outcome of the story, or say that it won't but actually lie about it.

MsFicwriter 09-20-2012 10:47 PM

My personal beefs with Dragon Age II:

1) Reusing the same environments over and over for supposedly-different quests. For example, there is a series of several taking place in caves, but no matter what your objective in those caves may be, it's the SAME. EXACT. CAVE. I kid you not...

2) The dialogue wheel for Hawke. Dragon Age: Origins had more thoughtful options.

3) The fact that you couldn't play a Dwarf or Elf in Dragon Age II. That was one of the most attractive features of the game for me.

4) Customization. Why couldn't you customize Hawke's weight or height, for example?

5) Lack of meaningful outcome options for most of the quests, even the main ones.

DarthParametric 09-20-2012 11:34 PM

You should prepare for a good portion of your beefs to remain for DA3.
  1. They have mentioned a number of times they are addressing the recycling, so you should be ok with this one.
  2. The dialogue wheel and ME style vague summaries is remaining (along with voiced protagonist).
  3. Almost certainly you will be human only again. Primarily because of the cost of recording extra protagonist dialogue, but they'll likely sprout some line about other races not fitting their "artistic vision".
  4. This was not in DA1 either, so it's probably an unfair gripe to level against DA2. It seems highly unlikely to be included in DA3, especially for height, due to potential alignment issues with cutscenes. Can't have anything that might adversely affect their cinematic artistry.
  5. Again, this is something not restricted to DA2. Bioware is the king of illusion of choice. It's the price you pay for their style of narrative. Despite their claims to the contrary before the release of ME3, it's their story and you are just watching a movie of it, occasionally pressing some buttons. Across their back catalogue the only real choices that result in noticeably different outcomes are usually right at the end of the game: godhood or mortality in BG2 TOB, lightside or darkside in KOTOR, open palm or closed fist in Jade Empire. In both DA2 and ME3 the choices offered at the end were much more of the illusion of choice variety, and I wouldn't be surprised if DA3 is of this latter variety.

mimartin 09-21-2012 01:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alkonium (Post 2819374)
Dragon Age II's story seemed to revolve more around people than fighting ancient evil.

That was one of the few things I liked better about DA2. That and I like the wheel and voiced PC.

stoffe 09-21-2012 05:27 AM

Personally I liked Ğragon Age II well enough. It was different from Origins, but still fun. Some of it was worse than the predecessor, other things were better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsFicwriter (Post 2819377)
1) Reusing the same environments over and over for supposedly-different quests. For example, there is a series of several taking place in caves, but no matter what your objective in those caves may be, it's the SAME. EXACT. CAVE. I kid you not...

While most games do this to some extent, in Ğragon Age II it done so overtly it was glaring. A better mix of new and recycled, and more effort taken to conceal reuse of areas, would indeed be nice. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsFicwriter (Post 2819377)
2) The dialogue wheel for Hawke. Dragon Age: Origins had more thoughtful options.

I'm a bit mixed on this. The ability for your character to build a distinct personality, which was then reflected in dialogs, cutscenes and even ambient oneliners, was a very nice touch (joker-Hawke is still my favorite). Having spoken lines for the protagonist, instead of just a nodding mute, was also a large improvement. Though the dialog wheel did suffer from some of the same vagueness as it does in the Mass Effect games. It's not always obvious what your character will say or do when a particular option is picked. This could've been solved as easily as displaying what will be said in a popup tooltip if you hover the mouse over a response option.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsFicwriter (Post 2819377)
3) The fact that you couldn't play a Dwarf or Elf in Dragon Age II. That was one of the most attractive features of the game for me.

Given the plot of Ğragon Age II it is understandable why they did it. It's hard to tell a character-centric story if the protagonist could come from vastly different cultures and backgrounds. So while it does annoy me slightly (like the fixed nature of the Nameless One i PS:Torment did), I understood why they did it, and it was not enough to ruin the game for me. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsFicwriter (Post 2819377)
4) Customization. Why couldn't you customize Hawke's weight or height, for example?

Variable character size makes for a major headache when doing animations that's supposed to interact with another character or object. In Skyrim they solved it by resizing characters to the default size whenever they interacted with something, but that ended up looking silly too when an Altmer suddenly shrunk as soon as they sat down on a chair or leaned against a wall :)

I suppose the only real options here with the current technology is to either use the same character size for everyone (ĞA2), resize on the fly (Skyrim) or not use character animations that interact with other characters or game world objects (Guild Wars 2), or make a number of fixed body sizes and then make animation combos for all the different body sizes interacting with each other and game objects, which would increase the amount of animation required exponentially, which isn't really worth the time and effort.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MsFicwriter (Post 2819377)
5) Lack of meaningful outcome options for most of the quests, even the main ones.

It's a Bioware game, most of their games have a strictly linear main plot, and while you may be able to say different things, and in some cases choose between quests, you always end up in the same place. :)

Makes for good storytelling, though at the cost of player participation.

GeneralPloKoon 09-21-2012 11:20 AM

I do have DAII, but haven't played it yet because I wanted to play DA:O first...and I'm being rather slow about it... I will hopefully have it played by the time DAIII is released. :p

Red Hessian 10-23-2012 04:53 AM

Here's some DA3 concept art:

Show spoiler


Show spoiler


Show spoiler

igyman 10-23-2012 07:30 AM

And it seems DA3 will continue the "human only" trend:
http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mis...ons-on-twitter

Personally, I'm extremely disappointed with this, but then again my expectations in regards to Bioware games are at an all time low. Looking at the concept art above, while I do like the second and third piece, the first one indicates that they are keeping the art style of DA2 in its entirety, which is just another letdown for me (I've never expected them to change it completely, but tweaking it and restoring some elements of the Origins art style would have been nice, especially in the race design department).

Darth333 10-23-2012 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by igyman (Post 2821627)
And it seems DA3 will continue the "human only" trend:
http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mis...ons-on-twitter

It's the corollary to having a voiced pc... The stronger the personality of the main protagonist is, the less choice you have. It worked well for the Witcher (story built around a specific personage) but not so well for DA2 (limited choice to deal with voice over).

igyman 10-26-2012 08:14 AM

While I agree about the Witcher games pulling it off extremely well, I don't think a voiced player character makes fixed race a necessity. It does, as you said, make some personality specifics a necessity, but even with the Witcher example there were more than enough choices in how Grealt could act in a given situation. If they wanted to, Bioware could easily restore race selection and still have a voiced PC (same male voice, same female voice, regardless of race) with enough variety for each race and without rewriting entire dialogues to account for each race.

The problem is, I think, that Bioware's design team is so stuck in that cinematic trend that they have completely forgotten there are other ways to add variety to different races, like introducing racial traits, bonuses or weaknesses and/or special abilities available to each class, depending on the chosen race. Think something along the lines of VTM: Bloodlines and the various abilities each clan had - like the Toreadors having a seduction bonus, the Ventrue having that Mind Control dialogue option and in general Mind Control combat abilities, the Nosferatu being great hackers and lockpicks, but forced to use the sewers to move about and the Malkavians being completely insane. I'm sure something similar could be added to Dragon Age, only perhaps less drastic than the above examples. Combine that with some minor dialogue variety, a la DA: Origins, and the result would be pretty neat.

Taak Farst 10-27-2012 09:32 AM

Their way of slowly telling the community about it is really annoying. They said they would only announce it when they had something to show, and they have nothing.

Xarwarz 11-04-2012 12:13 PM

LIKE DA:O didnt really like part 2 being trapped in that city the whole game really. I like to venture into the world not streamlined running around town:¬:.

That being said hope the heard all the gripes and are prepared to make a better game im looking forward to DA:3

HED 11-03-2013 05:15 PM

I have to admit, with the return of the tactical camera and race choice (including qunari!), BioWare has regained my interest after DA2. Hopefully Inquisition doesn't disappoint.

Red Hessian 11-28-2013 04:48 AM

View page
YouTube Video

Sabretooth 11-28-2013 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Doctor (Post 2819247)
I found Dragon Age: Origins supremely disappointing. Haven't bothered with the second game yet.

In that case you'll probably like the second game much more. I'd recommend it, DA2 feels nothing like its derpy, cliché-replete predecessor.

Alkonium 11-28-2013 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabretooth (Post 2840670)
In that case you'll probably like the second game much more. I'd recommend it, DA2 feels nothing like its derpy, cliché-replete predecessor.

Is it fair to say that Dragon Age II looks more original, while Dragon Age Origins looks like a Lord of the Rings knockoff?

igyman 11-28-2013 06:15 PM

@RedHessian: Looks to be the same gameplay segment they showed at PAX. Still, the video quality of this one is better than the PAX recording and at least here we don't have to listen to a bunch of horny *derogatory term of your choice* going "OMG!" and "Woooooo!!!" every two minutes.

@Alkonium: To me personally, DA2 didn't look more original, nor did DA Origins look like a Lord of the Rings knockoff. From a purely visual standpoint, I've heard the LotR comparison mentioned mostly in the context of elven design. Origins does use the classic elven look, which I personally prefer, and its environments and technology look predominantly medieval, which is typical for fantasy settings, but I don't see how that makes it a LotR knockoff. By that same account, someone could accuse the Forgotten Realms setting, heck almost any fantasy setting, to be a LotR knockoff.

DA2 on the other hand tried something, well, I'm not sure what it was. The elves were Na'vi/Warcraft elves hybrids, the Qunari (technologically the most advanced race in Thedas) looked like savages, while the city looked kind of monotonous, like each building in each area was built from the same type of stone. And then with their DLC, especially MotA, they tried adding some more modern armor and clothing to a medieval setting, which felt completely out of place to me.

Inquisition does look a lot better visually, but it remains to be seen if the environments will be as colorful and interesting in design, or is it all about shaders, particle effects and physics.

Sabretooth 11-29-2013 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alkonium (Post 2840671)
Is it fair to say that Dragon Age II looks more original, while Dragon Age Origins looks like a Lord of the Rings knockoff?

It's certainly more like the 'dark fantasy novel' feel that BioWare always talked about when they were introducing the DA franchise. DA:O feels like what you'd get if you took LotR, put hammy acting and B-movie characterisation and let someone from The History Channel direct it with a 300 aesthetic. "More blood? More blood."

DA2 tries a lot of new stuff, experimental stuff. I hate to sound pretentious (or oppositely, a pedestrian misappropriating fancy terms), but it's the closest attempt at a deconstruction of WRPGs since Planescape: Torment.

No, the game doesn't have some vast adventure across plains and valleys to vanquish some comical baddie with a totally sick helm. Haven't you done that in every role-playing game already? I mean seriously you guys who use this argument, could you not stand for one role-playing game that doesn't copy-paste the same plot everyone has ever used?

Instead the game tries something different, sure, let's do something no RPG has done before, and have a biographical focus on the player character and his impact on a single city, his home. What a stupid thing to do, huh? How could BioWare have known that after playing over 9000 cliche-ridden RPGs, players would want more of the exact same **** they've been playing, only with better graphics. What's this? Is Skyrim out? A game where you waltz around and do entirely boring stuff selling gear and talking to people who talk oh god so slow and fight monsters in totally-not-repetitive caves with a clunky combat system? GAME OF THE YEAR AMIRITE LADS.

Then there's the complaints about the repetitive environments. Because you know, other RPGs, that don't repeat environments are so enthralling. Behold the caves in Skyrim, and their sharp sense of variety in offering one rock formation so slightly different from the other. Truly 9.5/10 material. Behold Dragon Age: Origins, and how the annoyingly long dungeon stretches further into, oh what's this, an even ****ing longer dungeon. So amaze.

How many of you even remember or care enough about dungeon layouts? All I remember about all the RPGs I've played are some 'shots' of combat in my head. A freeze frame of Zalbaar swinging a sword on Kashyyyk. My character fighting in a bandit camp in Baldur's Gate. Shepard crouching behind a piece of waist-high cover. Which waist-high cover you ask? WELL I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE THEY ALL LOOKED THE SAME TO ME SON.

Dragon Age 2's approach I actually found very economical and intelligent, allowing more focus on storytelling and a better pacing of combat. I remember its dungeons and combat areas just as distinctly as other RPGs. But of course, they probably didn't realise there's people who actually enjoyed slogging through that dwarf place in the first game. What's that? There's no Fade section in DA3? Pre-order cancelled.

DarthParametric 11-30-2013 01:37 AM

I'm all for Bioware abandoning their standard "chosen one hero that saves the world" story template, but DA2's plot is not exactly what I would call an improvement. The basic premise may have had some promise, but they seriously went full retard with it.

HED 02-03-2014 07:22 PM

I liked DA2's approach in theory, but in practice there was just... something off, that kept me from getting as immersed in the game as with DAO or even Mass Effect. (I also didn't really like the combat changes, which is a more concrete complaint.)


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