View Single Post
Old 12-19-2009, 12:23 AM   #83
Achilles
Dapper Chimp
 
Achilles's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 8,204
Helpful! Veteran Modder Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Jedi Han View Post
About the Bible:

What my CHRISTIAN teacher told me is that the first written texts about Jesus came much later than him, like a few hundred years after, if I'm not completely wrong.
It's difficult to say with any degree of certainty. We have very good reasons to believe that the first gospel was written at least 40 years after jesus' alleged death (~75 AD per a reference to the destruction of the temple by the Romans).

The oldest fragment that we have is dated to about 125 BC (iirc EDIT: See P52). Obviously other writing could have existed elsewhere in that ~50 year gap, but we don't have any evidence for them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Jedi Han View Post
To preserve his miracles, stories were orally carried through generations.
The fact that you acknowledge apparent discrepancies in your post says a great deal about how accurate and/or consistent that process was

HINT: we can't get people to agree on jesus even after everything was written down and the advent of the movable type made it possible to eliminate "scribal error".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Jedi Han View Post
The result is that we get different versions of one story. This becomes really complicated for you then...

Second: What Marcus wrote, is the same as what Lucas wrote, but yet differs from him. I don't really remember which of them said these following things, but I've kept it well in my head:

When Jesus (peace upon him) was crucified, he told God to forgive their sins as they're ignorant. (With their referring to the crucifiers eg Roman soldiers, etc...)

While another says:

When Jesus (peace upon him) was crucified, he spoke to God, saying: "Lahi" or "Eli (= God), did you leave me?" (it may be wrong, but I remember well that there were two contradictions in the different Gospels)

Another thing: Jesus asks for water.

In one Gospel, a Roman centurion puts a sponge on his spear, drips it in water and tends it to Jesus. In another one, it was completely different.

This is just to say that many versions exist, but we will never know which one is true.
Indeed. So if we have different, conflicting stories, then on what basis should we assume that any of them are true? If these stories are the only reason that we believe that jesus existed, then why should we believe that either?

quasi-off-topic: If I may recommend a book...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Jedi Han View Post
And by the way: I'm a muslim, and recognize Jesus as a Messenger of God, but not as His son. Of course, that is for another thread.
"Peace be upon him" was a dead give-away, but thanks for clarifying nonetheless
Achilles is offline   you may: quote & reply,