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View Poll Results: Do you like the new faction, the Zann Consortium?
LOVE EM!! 10 20.83%
yes 19 39.58%
bit average 7 14.58%
they're garbage 12 25.00%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: Zann Consortium
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:30 PM   #41
mrsparkle
 
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seriously man, you just seem to hate anythink that isnt from the original trilogy.
I also dislike many things that aren't from the original trilogy. Some things just don't fit well. And the expanded universe is out of hand. Like lightsaber whips. Lightsaber whips?? Even though lightsabers are fantasy you can almost understand how they work. But an energy beam that acts like a whip? This isn't D&D.

And Tolkien too knew about the problem with using the eagles to destroy the ring. He addressed it at some point, but I forgot his reason for that not being possible. I do remember part of the reason being that it just wouldn't make for a good story (just like how evil people have to leave ways for the good guys to defeat them, like the tunnels in the death star II that lead straight to the core). That's also the reason he didn't use Bombadil; that and the fact that the Bombadil portion of the story was written before he finalized the rest of the story. That's why the first half of Fellowship of the Ring feels so much different.

Back on topic: You guys think they will make the AT-AT a transport with a patch? I would love to see it. Who says the empire can't have 2 transports? One with lots of firepower but fairly limited as to where it can step and vulnerable to speeder cables, and one without the firepower but more reliable movement?
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:40 PM   #42
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Nah i dont think they will. Its something that if they were going to do they would have done by now. When i get motivated again and update my mod I will be adding that feature though. Its not like its going to imbalance the game or anything...sure infantry are protected but how much slower are ATATs compared to Stormtroopers...
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Old 12-14-2006, 07:46 PM   #43
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night sisters ruin a AT-AT's day though. D:

those rancors are really hardy.




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Old 12-15-2006, 04:39 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by jedi jim 1989
yertyl star wars AINT REAL. the force doesnt exist so you cant compare it to reality like you did with the mouse. for starters sentients that can yse the force HAVE a mechanism against gravity. you see it more then once and read it etc etc. seriously man, you just seem to hate anythink that isnt from the original trilogy.

and the vornskrs use the force like a sence, like smell or hearing. i think it works as follows:

they detect things in the force, such as jedi and sith do, they feel all the living things, but they prefer to eat things stronger in the force.
I simply regard the Force as something as natural as gravity (in SW that is): "An energy field created by all living things" - and I find it stupid that an animal should have the ability to cancel something like that (especially since it basically is "a living thing" itself).
I'm relatively OK with animals hunting using the Force (well, I am against the concept of Force-sensivity being directly biologically caused though, since it raises a lot of problems)
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Old 12-15-2006, 06:46 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by YertyL
Well, falcons hunt mice using gravity - it's only logical that mice develop a mechanism that cancels gravity, isn't it?
Well, on the other hand we could also put mice into an amror that deflects bullets, would that be better? Or we could make the mice falcons as well - I don't see another possibility though...
YertyL, your example is so bad that it's borderline retarded. Falcons don't hunt 'using gravity' in the same the Vornskrs use the force. That's just as ridiculous as saying that there animals that hunt using their wings, so that means it's only logical there are creatures that can cancel out wings. Which is obviously complete bull s**t.

Falcons sense their prey using sight. Hence mice have a colouration and natural instinct to remain hidden. Sight is one of the major senses in the animal kingdom, and hence it's only logical that there are creatures that can rmeian hidden, either through the ability to mimic, hide, change colour or are camoflaged.

In the same way, a creature that uses the force to sense its prey is weak to a creature that can hide it's presence in the force..... in exactly the same way that a creature can hide it's presence in sight.


Quote:
Partially true, however:
1. Faramir did get affected by the ring like everyone else, however he was able to resist it (like e.g. Aragorn and Gandalf)
2.Bobadil did not get affected by the ring, however he wasn't a substantial plot element but more an illustration that there are other powers in middle earth than Sauron, the Elves and the Wizards.
Analogous to the breeding of clones using Ysalamiri and the cloning of Luke would perhaps be the following: Bobadil follows Frodo, joins the Fellowship and easily casts the Ring into the fires of Mount Doom, since he is unaffected by it.
Before he can do so however he must duel Sauron in an epic fight, since it is revealed that Sauron is in reality Bombadil's evil step-brother.
Sounds like fun, doesn't it?
I'm not even going to bother to decipher what on earth you're going on about here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsparkle
I also dislike many things that aren't from the original trilogy. Some things just don't fit well. And the expanded universe is out of hand. Like lightsaber whips. Lightsaber whips?? Even though lightsabers are fantasy you can almost understand how they work. But an energy beam that acts like a whip? This isn't D&D.
Who said anything about energy beams? Do you not understand the concept behind a Lightwhip? It's got more in common with Bowcaster quarrels than Lightsabres. It wraps a whip in an energy sheath.
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Old 12-15-2006, 10:23 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by TearsOfIsha
I'm not even going to bother to decipher what on earth you're going on about here.
Then let me distill it for you: he pretty much completely rebutted your Tolkien parallel. It was almost as bad as the gravity example.


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Old 12-15-2006, 12:38 PM   #47
jedi jim 1989
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ok now thats all sorted lol. i think the consortium is a kool idea but yes i agree they shouldnt have such great things, sorta like c&c general zero hour, if you played GLA then you didnt have great tech etc but you could use underhanded meathods, IMO i thinks that zanns forces just need to be toned down
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Old 12-15-2006, 07:35 PM   #48
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Do you not understand the concept behind a Lightwhip? It's got more in common with Bowcaster quarrels than Lightsabres. It wraps a whip in an energy sheath.
No I don't understand the concept behind a lightwhip, and I don't know what a bowcaster quarrel is. All I know is in FOC there's a female who uses a lightsaber whip. Is the whip wrapped in an energy sheath? It's not made entirely of energy like a lightsaber? I can accept that if that's the case. If it's not and the whip is pure energy, then I just can't accept it...some things are so fantasy they're actually too much fantasy, you know?
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Old 01-09-2007, 12:16 AM   #49
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I find it funny how people are still able to say a certain faction "pwns" when in actuality they should be balanced. I used the Rebels in the first game, but now the Empire falls prey to the mighty Zann Consortium.......so yeah, I think they're quite good.


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Old 01-29-2007, 06:10 PM   #50
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I love them! but i still prefer the mighty empire!


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Old 02-09-2007, 09:15 AM   #51
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I would agree
Note: your avatar is very similar to mine...



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Old 02-09-2007, 08:09 PM   #52
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I'm ok with the use of powerful units by the Consortium. However, the reason they are banned and outlawed is probably because they are unreliable. So why not actually make them unreliable in the game, like overloading or suddenly shutting down.

The second overpowering aspect of the Consortium is the ability to spread corruption so easily. It is incredibly annoying in conquest mode, every time I remove corruption with the Emperor or Thrawn it comes back a couple minutes later. ON top of that they destroy buildings easily, why cant we setup some buffer to prevent this? Imperial spies or commanders? heroes maybe? Something please, cause it doesn;t make much sense how the consortium is able to blow up high level buildings yet the Empire and Rebels can't without going into battle.

The other part is how the Rebellion and Empire can't spread their own influence, which I think could be a really nice addition to the game.

Lastly, why aren't power generators under the shield on some planets? They are basically gone if the enemy has artillary.

Oh and I forgot one thing, I think Thrawn should be able to remove corruption hehe.

Last edited by BanthaFodder01; 02-10-2007 at 08:09 PM.
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Old 02-10-2007, 02:54 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BanthaFodder01
I'm ok with the use of powerful units by the Consortium. However, the reason they are banned and outlawed is probably because they are unreliable. So why not actually make them unreliable in the game, like overloading or suddenly shutting down.

The second overpowering aspect of the Consortium is the ability to spread corruption so easily. It is incredibly annoying in conquest mode, every time I remove corruption with the Emperor or Thrawn it comes back a couple minutes later. ON top of that they destroy buildings easily, why cant we setup some buffer to prevent this? Imperial spies or commanders? heroes maybe? Something please, cause it doesn;t make much sense how the consortium is able to blow up high level buildings yet the Empire and Rebels can;t without going into battle.

The other part is how the Rebellion and Empire can;t spread their own influence, which I think could be a really nice addition to the game.

Lastly, why aren't shield generators under the shield on some planets? They are basically gone if the enemy has artillary.

Oh and I forgot one thing, I think Thrawn should be able to remove corruption hehe.

I think that's more an AI problem than a general ZC one. Spreading corruption generally costs more than removing it (1000 credits for a defiler and 1000+ credits for the corruption vs. 1500 for removing it) and sabotaging buildings costs 2 times the original price the first time and 4 times the original price the second time - plus 1000 credits for a defiler each time! A Human player is really restricted to a few strategical sabotages if any at all (I rarely bother to sabotage since it's most often far cheaper to destroy a building the normal way, even if you lose some units).
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Old 02-11-2007, 01:22 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by BanthaFodder01
I'm ok with the use of powerful units by the Consortium. However, the reason they are banned and outlawed is probably because they are unreliable. So why not actually make them unreliable in the game, like overloading or suddenly shutting down.
I think that's the best, most creative idea for balancing the Consortium I'm ever heard. If Consortium units broke ranks wen they suffered some amount of casualties, or sometimes ignored orders to go after easy targets, or sometimes their weapons just jammed and they lost some health--man, that would be interesting to see.


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Old 02-23-2007, 10:44 PM   #55
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Ok Sparkle first of all the yslarmi are not used on luke skywaler realy at all. They are used so thrawn can get pased the dark jedi gaurding the emperores toys in a mountain on some world. The yslarmi are used against luke by karrade though becuase luke visits them and karrade needs a way to hold a jedi master. Also yes the vorneks hunt using the force as a sense and it makes perfecrt sense that a creature that it preys on would adapt to be hidden unseeable through the force.

So they are not just a quick way to get out of an easy problem as you see it but are a unique addition to the star wars universe, besides there not even that useful i mean only a handfull of people are trained in the force and an anti force bubble does not stop you from shooting someone, blowing them up, or lopping thier head off with a lightsaber. On top of this of course a grand Admiral who is also a chiss would find some way to get around the jedi and it makes perfect sense for this creature to present it's self and is also used quite alot in the star wars books taken after thrawns reign
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Old 02-26-2007, 03:24 PM   #56
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ZC is a decent concept, but they seem to be overpowered.

The Corruption and endless Sabotage is annoying. The script will allow you to cancel the AI from doing one of either of these two things, or both. I think the AI cheats when it comes to money to pay for all the Sabotage and Corruption spreading.

Testing with the ZC on only one planet with a special set up, they can seem to 'magically' spread Corruption quickly with no apparent money.??

The AI cheats by making these 'magic' garrisions and thing too??

I tried to control how fast the 'sleep time' for a Corruption or Sabotage planet mission would happen, but it does not seem to matter. You can, as said above, remove one or the either, or both out the AI lua script very easy.
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Old 02-27-2007, 11:56 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by Thrawn_62
Ok Sparkle first of all the yslarmi are not used on luke skywaler realy at all. They are used so thrawn can get pased the dark jedi gaurding the emperores toys in a mountain on some world. The yslarmi are used against luke by karrade though becuase luke visits them and karrade needs a way to hold a jedi master. Also yes the vorneks hunt using the force as a sense and it makes perfecrt sense that a creature that it preys on would adapt to be hidden unseeable through the force.

So they are not just a quick way to get out of an easy problem as you see it but are a unique addition to the star wars universe, besides there not even that useful i mean only a handfull of people are trained in the force and an anti force bubble does not stop you from shooting someone, blowing them up, or lopping thier head off with a lightsaber. On top of this of course a grand Admiral who is also a chiss would find some way to get around the jedi and it makes perfect sense for this creature to present it's self and is also used quite alot in the star wars books taken after thrawns reign
Even though I posted that stuff last year, I still don't like ysalamiri. They don't fit. I only take the original trilogy as canon. It just doesn't make sense for a creature to be able to block the force. The only reason they can is because the author that created them had no other viable way for his antagonists to challenge a jedi save making them jedi themselves, and I guess he didn't want to do that.

They do not fit with the spirit of the original trilogy and therefore I cannot accept them. Nothing will convince me otherwise. I never read any of the books and probably never will. For me, only the original trilogy counts and perhaps the future TV show depending on it's storylines.
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