Help Moneky Island 4 Models

[myzinsky]

hi,
how can i rip monkey island 4 models??

[bgbennyboy]

You cant, we dont understand the format yet. You can rip the textures with EMI viewer.

[myzinsky]

where can i download this tool???

[bgbennyboy]

http://gamefileformats.the-underdogs...viewer-2.6.zip

[myzinsky]

thx it works,
but how i can see the models :-(
i can only see the textures
i need models :-)

[john_doe]

We don't know the file structure of the models (yet).
I examined them with my little 3d knowledge and found some useful information, but I really know too liittle about 3d stuff to actually do something useful with it.

[Alien426]

Do you need it for Return Of The Tentacle?

The freakin' measures to prevent someone from copying text suck ass and are waaaaay over-reacting and overweening.

[john_doe]

I fumbled around with some small files (the .meshb ones, they're used for static objects).
This is what I've found out so far (contains many errors and wrong assumptions, though):

definitons:
vector3d = float x,y,z
vector2d = float x,y

string:
long length
byte*length string data


start:
string MeshName Name of the mesh
vector3d u[4] unknown (maybe for collision detection)

long numtex Number of textures used
string texname[numtex] Texture filenames (incl. path information)

long u unknown, is 0x13 in many files
long numvert Number of vertices or similar
vector3d vectors[numvert] Vertex data
vector3d datda[numvert] unknown data
(Vertex data and unknown data are 2*numverts*sizeof(vector3d) in size, maybe they're one block instead of two)

byte size is numvert * 4 unknown
[in manhole.meshb there are other values, seems to be 4 bytes per entry. maybe vertex lighting data (looks like RGBA color values)]


long unknown count usually 0x02
repeated unknown count times {
long id/flags usually 0x0304
long unknown usually 0x00
long faces Number of faces
}


vector2d texcoords[numvert] texture coords (one vector2d for each vector3d?)


My 3d knowledge is at a bare minimum, so please excuse the lack of proper terms.

[john_doe]

An update.
I've made a viewer for the static meshes (.meshb) which works with some of the files I tested except for one (see the text below).
I hope I can figure out how to handle this one file and also enable texture support and export to other file formats (probably something easy, like text-only).

definitons:
-------------
vector3d = float x,y,z
vector2d = float x,y

string:
---------
long		length
byte*length	string data


start:
--------
string		MeshName		Name of the mesh
vector3d	u[4]			unknown (maybe for collision detection)

long		numtex			Number of textures used
string		texname[numtex]		Texture filenames (incl. path information)

long		u			unknown, is 0x13 in many files
long		numvert			Number of vertices or similar
vector3d	vectors[numvert]	Vertex data
vector3d	normals[numvert]	Normal data

byte		size is numvert * 4	colormap
					[in manhole.meshb there are other values, seems to be 4 bytes per entry. maybe vertex lighting data (looks like RGBA color values)]

vector2d	texcoords[numvert]	texture coords (one vector2d for each vector3d?)

(--> here the difference with manhole.meshb starts, s.b.)
long		unknown	count		usually 0x02
repeated unknown count times {
long		id/flags		usually 0x0304
long		unknown			usually 0x00
long		facescount		Number of faces
word		faces[facescount]	the faces data
}

long		end			some end marker (maybe block id), 0x00

I examined bronzehat.meshb and hankey.meshb to find this out.
Another file, manhole.meshb, is different - it only has one "object" (can't think of a better name atm) and doesn't work with these specs completely.
manhole.meshb also has some more data at the end, probably for animation or similar.

(Note: "Usually" means it's the same in all the files above I've checked.)

[bgbennyboy]

Wow fantastic stuff! Heh you really do work fast.

[myzinsky]

hi,
my problem is:
i cant speak english very well .... :-(
i want to know:

do you make a program with that i can see th models and i can make screenshots????

i need the models for "sherman toothrott"
( http://www.toothrot.de.vu/ )
this is the biggest fan adventure of monkey island !

[john_doe]

I've finally found out the format of the "problem" mesh. Now my little tool can display all my test-meshes with a dummy texture.
Next step is to implement the usage of the real texture and to test if it works with all .meshb files.
Then I'll probably write an exporter for Wavefront (easiest 3d format I know).

I didin't look at the .animb files yet but I guess they're much harder for me to do as they contain animation stuff etc. and I know next to nothing about that.

[bgbennyboy]

Excellent! I cant wait for that.

As a totally neutral party, with no vested interests at all I think you should move onto tiles next

[myzinsky]

o hope thet i have understood what yo have sayd :-) (bad english im from germany LOL )

can you send me the tool????
myzinsky@web.de

[john_doe]

@myzinsky:
The tool is not done yet.

(Das Programm ist noch nicht fertig. Ich bin noch am rumbasteln, dürfte aber bald soweit sein daß man wenigstens Screenshots machen kann, falls das hilft.)

[myzinsky]

(ah ok kannst dich ja dann melden!!!)

i need this toool _:-)

[john_doe]

The tool is almost done, now it can open the meshes directly from Emi bundles and it also uses the textures (even animated ones, though, only the first frame is used as of now).

Benny, I'll have a look at the tiles, too, but first I want to figure out more about the anim format.
It's not that complicated structure-wise, but it'll be hard to actually animate something with it (for someone who knows little about 3d coding and even less about maths ).

[bgbennyboy]

Heh you keep going, you're making great progress.

I'm still looking at the tiles myself but i'm not really sure about the co-ordinates and stuff, they seem very dodgy when I try and draw them to screen. They must be relative to something like you suggested. I'll keep messing with them then hopefully you wont need to look at them

[myzinsky]

john can you writ in german and english please :-) i can't understand all :-)

[john_doe]

Whee!
I've now released the first beta. It still has some quirks and few meshes crash it but in general it mostly works.

You can download it from here: gamefileformats.the-underdogs.org/files/emimeshviewer-0.1beta.zip


@myzinsky:
Ok. Also, die Beta-Version vom Programm ist fertig. Download-Link siehe oben.
Es dürfte einfach zu bedienen sein: File->Open bundle... öffnet eine .m4b-Datei (auf der CD). Danach aus der Liste rechts unten ein Mesh auswählen und doppelklicken. Screenshots kann man jedenfalls schon machen, Export kommt später.

[bgbennyboy]

Excellent, let the testing commence!

[bgbennyboy]

I'll report any bugs I find, I think you know about them already though.
Using artall.m4b:

fx\screen1.meshb produces the 'texture not found' and 'unsupported texture warnings' ('zu wenig arbeitsspeischer'?) but also every time the mouse moves over the model display window, it produces what looks like an access violation (I cant tell for sure because its in German)

After the access violation when you then select a valid mesh the textures are white, if you click again the normal textures are displayed.

When you minimise or the window goes out of focus, the model doesnt display again until you do a mouseover. So thats just a case of using OnPaint() or its gl equivalent I presume.

Some models appear to have too few polygons, especially on the faces. For example cla_low and nav_low. [Edit] since its _low in the filenames this is probably correct.

Great work though, its really good

Just out of curiosity, what other games are you planning to support in your resource viewer besides EMI and Grim?

Oh and Gabez was going to post about this on The Scumm Bar but I said it was better not to for this beta, otherwise you'd be barraged with bug reports. I hope thats ok?

[myzinsky]

sau geil!!! nur jezt müsst emna wie in poser das model bewegen können!! :-)

[john_doe]

Yes, the meshes in the fx folder don't seem to work correctly. Don't know yet why.

I know about the "screen refresh" problem but forgot to mention it in the readme. I don't know why this happens - I have a Paint call when it's needed (after loading and in FormPaint). I even call the MouseMove even but doesn't seem to work.


And I want to add support for other bundle-based games as well in my viewer (like Outlaws etc.). I just thought of it and am not sure if it really gets done, but it wouldn't be that hard since I'd just need to create a new bundle-class for the bundle format and the viewers for the textures and stuff. Still not sure, though, EMI and Grim are more important for me.

Currently I'm looking into the animation stuff but it's hard as hell.
I know EMI uses a skeleton-based animation system using quaternions for rotations...but that's it.
I tried to load a skeleton file (.sklb) and display it over the mesh but the bones didn't look to be at their right position.
And there's really not much info about this topic on the net (just very game specific stuff)...

[myzinsky]

nur jezt müsst emna wie in poser das model bewegen können!!

[john_doe]

Hi there,

I've found out a lot since yesterday.

I'm still not quite sure how the skeleton files are made up. I think I know where the bone data is stored but there are some more values I don't yet know.

I've found out more about the animation files (.animb).
They store keyframes which tell the positions of a bone at a specific time in the animation.
Each bone has its own keyframe-list. Also, I've encountered two types of keyframe-lists: One that store rotations (using quaternions) and one that stores transformations as a 3d vector.

I've also updated the mesh specs but they've grown to big to post everytime so I'll upload them when I'm at home.

[myzinsky]

wenn ichs richtig verstanden habe machst du ein update! wo kann ich es downloaden?

[john_doe]

Now I've found out most of the file specs (meshb, animb and sklb).
I'll put up the specs when I'm at home.
But I just can't get the skeleton to show correctly. It almost looks good but only almost.
There's probably something I'm missing.

If anyone who has experience in 3d stuff reads this please contact me to help if you want.

[bgbennyboy]

Someone help him, I demand it

[john_doe]

I've compiled all my knowledge about the 3d files into a text file that you can download from here:
Escape from Monkey Island model specs

There's still some stuff missing but the majority of stuff seems to be right.

[bgbennyboy]

Nice one, its so much better when people document stuff Great work.

[Krazy]

Will you ever be able to see all the characters animations? That would be cool.

[myzinsky]

eed the tool!!!!!

[Serge]

Great work, as always, Ben (john)! Which reminds me... Working on something at the moment, something very small, very tiny, and probably never to be finished, much less released. But if it does, may I use the formats you've figured out since I last roamed in the LEC community? (You might have guessed by now what it is) Thanks are given, of course, where thanks are due - and I'm devising a scheme to make it a bit more elaborate than the previous "thank you" lists I've done.

Oh, and may I use your real name, bg, in case you turn up in the thanks list too? Just need to gather permissions for something I'll never do anyway

Oh, and if you (bg) have any idea where Murray is, ask him about the cgi-irc thingy. No way for me to get on IRC without it

- Serge

[Serge]

Heck, that SCUMMLord title is really misleading by now

- Serge

[john_doe]

@Serge:

Thanks and of course

[myzinsky]

jon ich hab nicht verstanden was er gemeint hat kannst du das bitte nochmal zusammenfassen??? THX

[Tomas]

Oh my, I almost fell off my chair when I read Serge's name there.

Really.

Well, umm, that's about all I had to say...

[Serge]

Ben: Thanks!

myz: Was ich gesagt habe hat nichts zu tun mit der "ripping" von Monkey Island 4 models. Ich benutzte nur diesen "Thread" weil ich wirklich nicht ein langes Thread anfangen will, das über ein Gerücht basiert ist.

Ich fragte nur ob ich john_doe's Code anwenden kann, wenn ich vielleicht ein projekt wieder aufnehme.

Excuse my poor German Needed to try and use that again...

Tomas: I'm pretty much a constant lurker here... Just never have anything useful to say since I'm not working on anything, and most people here know all that I know anyway, and can answer the questions asked better

Oh, and Tomas... If you have some contacts capable of setting up a cgi-irc script like the one Murray once had on some server, so that I can once again access IRC, I'd be eternally grateful.

- Serge

[jannar85]

Originally posted by Serge

Oh, and Tomas... If you have some contacts capable of setting up a cgi-irc script like the one Murray once had on some server, so that I can once again access IRC, I'd be eternally grateful.

www.dikt.no

click chat on the left

then "Klikk her for å starte webchat! "

then.. advanced

then.. fill in the info

and then login