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View Poll Results: Who is your favourite Team Corellia member so far?
Jaden Car'Let (Jedi) 4 23.53%
Lt. Castle (CorSec) 1 5.88%
Cpl. Anders (New Republic Army) 5 29.41%
Pvt. Alan Dalta (New Republic Army) 0 0%
Pvt. Luke Harris (New Republic Army) 2 11.76%
Agent Black (New Republic Intelligence) 3 17.65%
Makso (Mercenary) 2 11.76%
Voters: 17. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: Team Corellia
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Old 01-01-2004, 02:50 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by idontlikegeorge
it seems that all the reviews are from those in the map-review community...
Hey, at least I'm not in the staff (though I do strive to become the Official Forum Maniac or at least Official Forum Regular)!

But yeah, this thread took a nasty sideturn along the road... Let's just ignore ANYONE who starts flaming again and hope they go away! Yeah, you hear me, you're all a bunch of ****************************************** **** **************** ****** *********!!! Okay, like I said, ignore stuff like that!



So... Any small spoilers about what Part II might involve?

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Old 01-01-2004, 11:32 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by idontlikegeorge

I felt the scene with Carlet walking to the CorSec office to be awfully inane - and (YAY!) we got a great view of the sidewalk!
Um... You know what, you are absolutely right. I guess I knew that all along, but after I had spent hours and still many hours more mapping the setting, I just didn't have the heart to cut it out. Believe it or not, but I shortened it quite a bit! But I just couldn't cut the whole scene with Car'Let walking into the building out. Kengo would have done that, if he had been a real movie director, and not such a fine fellow as he is. I guess he took pity on me, and didn't say anything, but let it be there (although, just as you said, it is useless and doesn't bring into the movie anything but a glance at some architecture).

Quote:
Originally posted by idontlikegeorge

Anyway, I realize there aren't easy ways to "fix" these things - I have played with scripting, and took me awhile just to get a single camera to move and pan to where I wanted it! But I would hope, that perhaps in future episodes, there will be a bit more optimizing of the flow of the cutscenes.
Well, as it is quite likely that I'm not mapping or scripting for the next episodes, you just might get what you wished for!
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Old 01-01-2004, 03:14 PM   #43
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I'm with you Tito, the threats are empty, so pay them no heed.

Zappa, I'd like to hear what you think. As for your earlier comment, all I will say is that clearly a load of posts have been deleted from this thread, you can see quite a lot of them in the various quotes.

IDLG - Appreciate the review I think you've picked up on the main points to address or look at for Part 2. Leslie Judge did really good with the voice of Anders, but I think in making him leave all those pauses I was overemphasising the fact that Anders is supposed to be a little strange and not completely at home with the language. It is too slow, and thats down to what I asked LJ to try to do (he did what I asked spot on!) - so we'll look at speeding his speech up in part 2.

The chief's voice was a little crackly, so I will talk to the voice actor to try to address that.

It is a little slow in places. I personally liked the slow walk of Car'Lets which although not vital to the story - made this middle section of the story more central and balanced out better with the long bridge street part. I also liked the idea of an atmospheric, long scene with some SW music and a look at the city streets to really promote that SW feeling. Also, Lasse's architecture had far more showoff-ability than mine, it deserved a long viewing time I thought As the first part, all of us were a little new to it and pacing is a hard thing to master, we will continue to work on that!

I also had some rather over-long conversations at Bridge Street where a character talks for a long time with no jokes. I will keep the final product in mind more clearly when editing the script for part 2.

GothiX, appreciate your review too. This cool feedback is a big help


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Old 01-01-2004, 04:57 PM   #44
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I thought the long walk was funny... I looked at it like a deliberate joke, like it's supposed to be dramatic in the beginning, then drags out for a long time...

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Old 01-01-2004, 09:38 PM   #45
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Like the opening spaceship flyby in Space Balls?


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Old 01-02-2004, 02:29 AM   #46
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AH well certainly a nice job. Liked the Mission Impossible thing, it was cool. I was hoping to see alittle action in this, but it still was ok. Scripting would definatly be for me, if it looked alittle better. I think I would get better camra views and it would be alittle more life like. But anyway keep up the nice work, I would most certainly like to see more from you guys.

Kengo it looks like you over looked my responce!
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Old 01-02-2004, 03:01 PM   #47
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Oh yes, so I did Zappa.

The MI bit was one of my favourite parts too, Niall came up with that bit!

There is definately more action in this than anything I scripted before, and Lassev did his usual superb job with the scripting. Hopefully as we learn more we can have more action like you say - that is I think the hardest thing to script, but perhaps the most rewarding too. I was pretty pleased with ther Camera work but again, hopefully we'll improve with practice


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Old 01-02-2004, 10:03 PM   #48
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Real action, like fighting, might prove out to be quite interesting a challenge. I have never scripted such. Hmm. I think Kengo has, if memory serves. Of course it would be quite easy with with the saber fighting, although the unpredictability might prove out to be a problem considering the placement and usage of cameras (follow command with camera groups sure would help).

However, as Team Corellia (until now I have called this Corellian Incident, and for some bizarre reason Kengo never corrected me ) does not contain but one saber user, I think the problem of creating more activity and a higher pace of action will be a bit more difficult. However, it might still work by letting in some randomness by avoiding an exclusive use of behavior_state("cinematic"). Some waypoints and point_of_combats, and there should be some nice action and exchange of bullets.

Kengo sure knows how to use dynamic camera movements, so he can easily increase the tempo just by using surprising angles and aggressive movements. Then throw in some script controlled explosions and smoke, and I think even idontlikegeorge would be forced to agree that the west front is not anymore so quiet...
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Old 01-02-2004, 10:59 PM   #49
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Can't you just make a few NPCs with appropriate team settings and health values, and then let them go at each other with a few defined waypoints, and then cut camera angles as the battle progresses? I think something similar was done for the Luke/Desann matchup on the Cairn dock.


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Old 01-03-2004, 08:29 AM   #50
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The Luke/Desann battle was scripted for every animation.


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Old 01-03-2004, 09:35 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by wedge2211
Can't you just make a few NPCs with appropriate team settings and health values, and then let them go at each other with a few defined waypoints, and then cut camera angles as the battle progresses? I think something similar was done for the Luke/Desann matchup on the Cairn dock.
That's basically what I meant. The problem is that the more waypoints you place the better the combat is dynamically, but in the same time it will make it harder to follow any specific NPC (actor) with a camera with any intelligent camera angles.

Although, now that I think about it, if I recall it correctly, you can set triggers to be triggered only by a specific NPC. That would allow you to place triggers along the way from waypoint to waypoint, to be launched only by the NPC you want to follow. Thus, you could trigger scripts to change totally dynamically the cameras so that they always have an intelligent angle to the NPC in question.

It would be complicated, and still you would need some master script to be behind everything, or count enemy deaths or something, to bring the movie back under absolute control at some point. Then you would need to bring the NPCs to locations you know. After that it would be again like an ordinary cinematic.
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Old 01-03-2004, 12:04 PM   #52
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Noooo, just lost a long and detailed post with an accidental key press!

It's an interesting topic, the whole action thing. Severeral ideas come to mind: How about making the JA and QT versions noticably different in some ways. For example, how about actual fight scenes the player can control occuring at certain points. For example a load of Dark Jedi could ambush the team and control then goes to the player as Jaden who gets to fight these enemies off. The option to not have to fight could perhaps be included. This would utilise the interactivity that is possible when building this in a game more perhaps.

As the QT version is essentially recorded ingame footage - we could use various methods to record this for action scenes. We could have AIs go at it as Wedge suggested, and record it until we get a version that looks cinematically about right, and use that. We could also have it in no_clip and just record there, using that view as the camera.

We could have a human player in SP or even several in MP acting out some of the action sequences - as they do in popular shows like RedvsBlue I believe. These could then be recorded and thrown into the places where action takes place.

Scripting saber fights is super complex, I believe, it would take an enormous amount of work. This is why, I think, Raven include so few cool saber fights in JO and JA. Simpler stuff like gunfights might not be so hard.

Part 2 is half suspence driven, creepy wandering and half ship based, small space type comedy. Part 3 is supposed to be scary, more than action packed. Part 4 however could see some more heavy action - not sure exactly what yet

Quote:
Originally posted by lassev
Of course it would be quite easy with with the saber fighting, although the unpredictability might prove out to be a problem considering the placement and usage of cameras (follow command with camera groups sure would help).

However, as Team Corellia (until now I have called this Corellian Incident, and for some bizarre reason Kengo never corrected me ) does not contain but one saber user, I think the problem of creating more activity and a higher pace of action will be a bit more difficult.
I think Master_Thomas did quite a good job with the camera follow command for randomised saber battles in his first level. It's an option certainly.

I thought you were being ecentric with the name there Jaden is the only saber user on the team, that we know of anyway, I guess the rest are tooled up with some bellow par, badly maintained Republic equipment....


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Old 01-03-2004, 03:30 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kengo
For example, how about actual fight scenes the player can control occuring at certain points. For example a load of Dark Jedi could ambush the team and control then goes to the player as Jaden who gets to fight these enemies off.
No. Boo. It's a movie, people watch it as such. Besides, if you give a human control, they are more than likely to do things you don't want them to, that aren't in the script (ie, kill all the GOOD guys, go run off and explore lassev's architecture, etc).

One thing you could do, I suppose, is have the movie fully scripted but let the viewer get spectator control. Let THEM control the camera angles. This is probably only cool for big battle scenes, and you might want to build "playerclip" boxes and teleports to force them to stay in and move between specific areas.

Quote:
We could also have it in no_clip and just record there, using that view as the camera.

We could have a human player in SP or even several in MP acting out some of the action sequences - as they do in popular shows like RedvsBlue I believe.
Again--no, boo. Your movies being fully scripted is what sets them apart from others out there. And...this is something you can't do in the JA versions, isn't it? :P


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Old 01-03-2004, 06:07 PM   #54
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I suppose you could make it an .ROQ file, but unless it looks very similar to the scripted sequence, it wouldn't work very well in my opinion.


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Old 01-03-2004, 07:41 PM   #55
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I agree with Wedge. Not only does a strict movie format prevent unwanted things to happen, but it also saves some work. With predefined camera angles (at least nearly) you can very well leave many places as facades. If you give player any control, they are, like Wedge said, bound to go exploring places they shouldn't.

And since this is a movie, I almost think that you should release it only in QT format. In the end there's no need to make it playable in game. It will also save the effort of making ROQ files. You can just put it together in your favorite video editing software.
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Old 01-03-2004, 07:50 PM   #56
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And I'd be more than happy to edit it together with my pro video editing software.

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Old 01-05-2004, 02:02 AM   #57
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I downloaded it and started it, and when the level finished loading it booted me back to the main menu with an "Error Unknown 234523434534" or something of the like.

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Old 01-05-2004, 06:10 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrawn42689
I downloaded it and started it, and when the level finished loading it booted me back to the main menu with an "Error Unknown 234523434534" or something of the like.
That's peculiar. Kengo's part was not prone to errors. Are you sure your download was not corrupt? Or maybe you have some interfering components in your base folder? It might also be worth the trouble to try both the installation ways Kengo provided.

But one thing is sure: JA seems not to be as user friendly as JO considering the publication of your works. The problems with subtitles, mission descriptions and such is not something a fellow with a normal train of thought may understand easily.
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Old 01-05-2004, 04:50 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thrawn42689
I downloaded it and started it, and when the level finished loading it booted me back to the main menu with an "Error Unknown 234523434534" or something of the like.
Yeh, I haven't seen or heard of that error for this before Lasev's suggestions are sound - if you put it in the base folder, perhaps you should sacrifice the subtitles and end credits and put it in a mod folder in the gamedata directory - this will avert any conflicts with other base files, if that is the problem. If not, maybe it is a corrupt download.

Just to explain further how I was thinking of doing the action scenes - for those of you that haven't played Final Fantasy games - when you get into a fight it goes all 3d (depends which one but you get the idea), music starts and the player is placed in control of the characters for the fight. I was thinking of something similar - you go into a fight scene, and are in a highly restricted area (player no go areas make this easy) where your only course of action is to conduct the fight. Allied NPCs can be outside of the no-go area willing you on (thats in keeping with most of their personalities...) or just invulnerable.

As for the recorded sections created within SP or MP and recorded - these would be only for very distinct action scenes. Scripting gives you a lot more control for most actions, camerawork etc, but full on saber fights simply aren't possible with scripting, unless I want to spend months and months on one short fight sequence. So for a few scenes, if well 'acted' by players, it might work out. It's an idea that has a lot of flaws, so I'm not really sure, it needs development definately! It would require full knowledge of recording (good qualty) footage ingame, and a couple of exceptional saberists as well. Luckily, I don't have to worry about these things for some parts to come!

I could maybe, as Eskimo suggested, use ROQ files for these recorded sections in the JA version. I really would like to look at some ROQ stuff in there somewhere, maybe for a fully animated intro and things like that (also maybe ship flybys and such - the kind of thing that would be CGI in a film) . Clu's amazing Colloseum shows just what you can accomplish if you really know how to make ROQ files!


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Old 01-06-2004, 02:50 PM   #60
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sweet, ill check it out tonight when i get home
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Old 01-07-2004, 06:38 PM   #61
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Looks nice. I havent checked it out yet, but I might after seeing the screengrabs. Also, I have the registered version of FRAPS so I would be able to make it in AVI format or whatever if someone wants to take it from there.

In other news, I dont think you will have to worry about Casperhead coming back to this threads *cracks knuckles* But definitely keep up the good work


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Old 01-07-2004, 07:38 PM   #62
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Might as well break the news also around here. The speed problem some people have unfortunately suffered with this movie (with my part of it anyway) are most probably due to the unreliability of DOWAIT("task") and WAIT("task") commands.

If you are keen on the subject, first compare for your own amusement the cinematic scripts of JO and JA. After you have noticed the big difference, you are as far as I was before Kengo decided to go straight to the source. I decided to join the gang and gatecrashed to the levelforge.teamhuh.com.

If you are truly interested about the shortcomings of ICARUS, go there are read the short but very enlightening answers we got from a reliable source.

So, to make the long story short, we well most likely be able to deliver a more universally working movie in a few days...
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Old 01-07-2004, 09:07 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally posted by Andy867
In other news, I dont think you will have to worry about Casperhead coming back to this threads *cracks knuckles* But definitely keep up the good work
Thanks for the assistance, Andy.

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Old 01-15-2004, 02:52 AM   #64
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Thanks for the assistance, Andy.
Ah Eldritch! Do you have a problem with people? Or do you have problems yourself? What did Casperhead do to you?
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Old 01-15-2004, 03:29 AM   #65
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Casper, you do know it is against LF.com to make multiple accounts, especially when you have been banned. Consider THIS screenname banned as well...


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Old 01-15-2004, 10:21 AM   #66
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Thanks twice over Andy. What can I say, I guess anytime someone comes in who has 1 post and immediately starts supporting poor old Casper 'who's been so badly treated and never does nothing to hurt nobody' I'll let you know! Casper, will you just stay out of this thread, I have no interest in your opinions and you have no interest in my work, so lets leave it at that.

I've got a new version of Team Corellia: Part 1 up at PCGM, the hope being that it fixes the dialogue speed problem some people had, after Lassev did some extensive work on the scripting. It also fixes the missing model thing, and adds German subtitle, briefing and credit support.

http://www.pcgamemods.com/3842/

I'm very interested to hear if that fixes the dialogue timing problem others had before.


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Old 01-15-2004, 10:40 AM   #67
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Great work guys.
I tried it out and it worked fine for me.
I didn't even have to select the difficulty in SP though, it shot straight into the movie as soon as I hit 'New'
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Old 01-15-2004, 08:03 PM   #68
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Why can't people get along? Sigh


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Old 01-15-2004, 08:06 PM   #69
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This is a warning to you andy. Go ahead ban this name but your going to have alot of fun banning names cause there will be another one after another. We are going to work this out peacefully or we can do things the hard way I was banned unfairly in the first place I'm not leaving and if I do leave I'm going to make sure this site gets its share of hell. We will talk this out on msn I think you know my address If not your going to keep banning and banning.
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Old 01-15-2004, 08:08 PM   #70
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Ah Eldritch! Do you have a problem with people? Or do you have problems yourself? What did Casperhead do to you?
Oh yeah one more thing you don't want me as a enemy.
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Old 01-15-2004, 08:43 PM   #71
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Will this guy EVER learn. Perhaps a Perma-ban will suit him best.


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Old 01-15-2004, 08:59 PM   #72
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Casper, please PM me so we can resolve this issue in a more civilized way.


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Old 01-15-2004, 09:48 PM   #73
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I agree sheesh


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Old 01-15-2004, 10:30 PM   #74
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Andy, if you're going to sort this out with Casper outside of this thread (which would be great) then could you please delete all his posts in here? I am sick of all my threads getting hijacked no matter how many times he gets banned, no matter how hard I try to ignore him. Oh, and personally, I don't believe people should get what they want by threatening others and harrasment.

DarkLord, can't you see the wood for the trees man? There are two sides of this, one wants to just have a normal freakin' showcase thread without people slagging them off and the other wants to harrass everyone into doing what they want them to. I can't believe you can possibly go along with what Casper is doing. I guess I shouldn't underestimate the power of denial? He's been banned at least FIVE times now DarkLord, don't tell me you believe they were all really unfair on the poor lil' guy? Man alive - wake up!


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Old 01-16-2004, 04:00 AM   #75
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If you are willing to knock some of the crap you wedge2211 and eldritch try to pull with me maybe I can be nicer.
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Old 01-16-2004, 05:40 AM   #76
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What crap? He seems to make this stuff up as he goes, or imagines it.

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Old 01-16-2004, 11:49 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally posted by Eldritch
Anakin, I hope you know what you're getting into with Casper. I can't say much to his current behavior as I believe he's been banned from here as well, but you're taking a big risk given his previous actions.
I don't like that kind of stuff Now I would like to work this out.
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Old 01-16-2004, 01:17 PM   #78
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Stop posting here, Casper. Kengo was very clear when he said that the first time.


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Old 01-16-2004, 01:22 PM   #79
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I don't believe LucasForums will let the person they banned at least five times back in just because he threatens to make trouble:

"We are going to work this out peacefully or we can do things the hard way I was banned unfairly in the first place I'm not leaving and if I do leave I'm going to make sure this site gets its share of hell"

You don't get it do you? You can't force someone to patch things up peacefully at gunpoint! Also, an argument that can be patched up has to be a disagreement between two people, not between me and the imaginery person you seem to think you are, who never does nothin' wrong. You see, this is the Casper I see:

You've gone out of your way to ruin two of my showcase threads, you (or your friends, yeh whatever) spammed Map-Review, you've threatened LucasForums and come back multiple times after being banned, you've been banned from PCGM for years after that whole attacking the site thing. You're only at Massassi because they unbanned all the people there, and I'm sure you'll manage to get banned from there AGAIN pretty fast. I'll make the safe guess you either don't visit, or have already been banned from JK2File's comments and forum system. You were thrown off the TMU team for threatening them with theft of their propery, after gaining entry to their team via a false name:

http://forums.massassi.net/html/Forum1/HTML/030568.html
http://forums.massassi.net/html/Forum1/HTML/031241.html

That's aside from harrasing people over IM programs with multiple screen names, a load of posts you handily deleted, and outright lies such as the one about me and Tito, a regular on the MR forums.

People shouldn't let you walk all over them for you to treat them with respect, you should treat people with at least common decency from the start. Anymore threats out of you, and I will carry out one of my own: I will attempt to get your ISP to remove access. I think over the past years you've done quite enough illegal stuff (and even boasted about it on public forums later) for that to be a very real threat. I don't want to have you barging onto one of my threads, or attacking a site I work at/for, or threatening one of my friends ever again. Don't post here anymore.


------------------------------------------------
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Last edited by Kengo; 01-16-2004 at 01:53 PM.
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Old 01-16-2004, 02:44 PM   #80
Casper
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No. I was never banned from the jk2files comment system. So your sounding like you don't wan't to work things out. well I apologize for hijacking your thread. For one If you want to say bad things abput me IM me and not in the forums.
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