Which alignment do you use? (JA)

[StaffSaberist]

If I use Speed+Absorb and get away, how will you keep up? By wasting 50 Force Points with speed yourself, after I have a 2 second head start? I find that difficult to believe that you would even consider such a tactic. Were I you at that point, I'd let the guy go, and catch up to him later, fragging others as you see fit.

Say I am facing you. You start winning, so I give you a Saber Staff kick and knock you to the ground. I turn on Speed, and go away. By the time you are back up, either a)I've gotten away, or b)I fell off a cliff somewhere from going too fast and running into a battle. What then, if a is true?

[Lathain Valtiel]

..What others? I've been talking about dueling, not FFA. Closest thing to others' only exists in Power Duel, which is a whole different animal.

Lightning and Drain have greater range than a blade. Second, at that point it can easily come down to who can strafe jump better, which is legitimate. However, you aren't doing damage either, now are you? Hence, in the end, he'll have Speed for a split second after you run out, and more Force than you if he follows. Hello Drain/Lightning I can't defend against!

[ZeroX2]

All you seem to be saying are the following:
-You are better than everybody else (you know everything about the game).
-Anybody that argues with you obviously doesn't know anything about the game, or lacks skill in the game.
-If you have difficulty performing something, it must be impossible, or require tremendous skill. It's inconceivable that you could be doing something wrong.

I guess you just like to argue, right?

Originally Posted by Lathain Valtiel

There is a delay after which you can activate it again.

But that doesn't stop you activating it. Sure, you'll get hit by some of the dark-side force, but not enough to fully drain or kill you. And when you reactivate Absorb, chances are, you'll absorb some of the opponent's force before he/she can release the button,

[Lathain Valtiel]

Ah, but you've TAKEN DAMAGE 'or' lost Force and they've regained health, and chances are you won't have enough force to Heal presuming the attacker is good at the button release. Meanwhile, they're better off and you aren't either way.

Hence, your argument is a tad useless.

[StaffSaberist]

Talking about Duels, LV? When did I say this was limited to duels? Never. In duels, yes, the Speed+Absorb strtegy is stupid. I'd be better off using only Speed and running rings around you. That would be funny gor the Spectators to watch. I meant for FFA when I mentioned Speed+Absorb.

In duels, I never use Absorb unless attacked by the Force. Thus, I do take a split-second of damage to health or Force mana. But that isn't really enough to worry about, a slash will take that off. Thus, I regain Force via my opponent, (And I turn off Absorb after the enemy is done) and I lose little health, he OTOH has lost Force Mana. Thus, your arguement is a tad useless.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Now you're just trying to look intelligent. And failing. Miserably.

Considering the fact that the argument between ACDCFanbill, me, and ZeroX2 centered around duel, I see no reason to care about your first paragraph, especially since 'running rings' around someone does no damage and is fairly easily countered even without applying Speed yourself.

As for your second paragraph... i'm sorry, but at this point you must be blind. Absorb makes a sound. Certainly, you've maybe regained a bit of Force, but they've also taken points off either your force or health meters, so chances are you aren't exactly better off. They can easily regenerate themselves by staying out of blade range for Force, and Draining you when Absorb goes down for health (or going for Lightning damage). Either way he gains and you are no better off. You lose. Insert a coin to try again.

[StaffSaberist]

Please! What kind of fool do you take us for? No frikken dur, Absorb makes a sound! I don't care! The Force you get back is worth a little sound! And what kind of idiot keeps Absorb on when the enemy is not using Force-based attacks? Sorry, but calling me an idiot and pretending to run the show only works if you are admin-ing a server. So, take this coin and shove it... *remembers that StaffSabetist is a light-ided character*

"you must be blind... absorb makes a sound..."

Um... I'd have to be deaf, right?

Okay, just to make absolutely sure you understand, I'll go over the scenario again:

1. Enemy tries Lightning/Drain/Grip.
2. I turn on Absorb, takibg 5-10 damage at worst.
3. Enemy ceases the futile Force attack.
4. I turn off Absorb, not wanting to waste Force Points.
5. Battle continues as normal. Steps 1-4 are usually repeated once or twice.
Your mileage may vary.

OK, so what's wrong with that? If the enemy wants to waste Force mana. fine. If not... the saber battle returns. I may win or I may not, depending on all the usual factors of saber combat.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Blind in context to reading my posts, obviously.

Why don't I edit in what'll happen when you turn off Absorb?

4. I turn off Absorb, not wanting to waste Force Points.
5a: I am Lightninged as it goes down, meaning I lose Health. Now I can either use Force Healing, which means me using Absorb is delayed, or I simply take the damage as is and Absorb to prevent sustaining more. The enemy gets to dodge and regen his force points.
5b: I am Drained dry, so that I can't even use Absorb anymore, and my enemy gains health.

[StaffSaberist]

You assume the opponent uses only Force attacks. Opponents usually try a saber blow while the other human is preoccupied hitting their Absorb toggle...

or better yet, their Mind Trick toggle, forcing the enemy to waste valuable Force Points in Seeing. If they have it.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Yeah, but I generally speak of good opponents. Which is pretty much mutually exclusive with the majority in JA.

No comment on Mind Trick, I have to check its force costs.

[ZeroX2]

Originally Posted by Lathain Valtiel

No comment on Mind Trick, I have to check its force costs.

It uses 20 force points to toggle it on.

[StaffSaberist]

And Force Seeing is the same, I believe. So, Abosrb, Mind Trick, and Heal vs. Grip, Drain and Lightning. (Protect and Rage aren't so useful as the others)This we have known about since JK3 came out. And yet, this is as far as we have gotten in this arguement. Nowhere. How ironic, in retrospect.

[Lathain Valtiel]

Regardless, you do not regenerate Force with Mind Trick active. So either way you wind up with less Force... So meh to Mind Trick, I'd rather regen my Force points than waste them using Seeing.

[StaffSaberist]

Hello, attack-from-behind!

I just had to say that. In the end, I suppose it all boils down to personal preference. I can't believe I'm saying this about my own thread, but it is due for closure. We've had our argument, and blown off steam... again.

[thehomicidalegg]

mindtrick is pretty useful if the server has jk2 kicks enabled, because it does not turn off when you kick, so it forces the opponent to use seeing

[ZeroX2]

Or if you kick via the Saber Staff.

I've had a lot of fun Mind-Trick-Kicking flag carriers around that are foolish enough to Force Speed in a straight line. ^^

[StaffSaberist]

I've got the flag! Lemme look for enemies!

<.<

>.>

>.<

Don't see anybody! *Runs* *Gets kicked, sabered*

An all too common problem with n00bs.

I like to mix kicks in with my saber attacks. If I succeed, I either Heal or Speed off. i don't do a finishing move b/c I get called a n00b. Oh, well...

[Kurgan]

One thing I realize I never thought about... can a Drain user regain health from an enemy with no mana left? I know you can use Drain on them, but will it do anything if there's nothing left to Drain?

[acdcfanbill]

yes, you can debate all the stratigies you want, but when it comes down to it, no light sider has ever defeated a darksider in competitive play, in fact, i've never even seen a good player even use lightside in FF duels.

[acdcfanbill]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

One thing I realize I never thought about... can a Drain user regain health from an enemy with no mana left? I know you can use Drain on them, but will it do anything if there's nothing left to Drain?

no you dont get any health from a person with 0 force, however, it normally occurs like this...

you are draining someone and since your a good player, you've waited until you know you have more force than they do (based on actions you've both taken) and you toggle drain on (hold key or w/e). now that its on, it will run you down to ~20 force points and kick off, since you made sure you had more than the other guy, he will go down to zero. you will both regen a few points, until your drain kicks back on automatically (if your holding it, or toggled it) and will take his few (5-10) force points back away, giving you only a few health points (5 or so if i remimber right). any patient dark sider will keep just out of saber range and just in drain range til they are full health and go back to fighting, while being 20 force points up on the competition.

[StaffSaberist]

I thought if you were out of mana, it took your health. At least, I know that's happened to me a couple of times, when I was out of mana finishing a round of Absorb.

[RobQel-Droma]

Mostly I use lightside powers as a majority, with only Grip and Lightning for DS powers. As far as I am concerned, Rage and Drain are useless unless you have them rank 3; and by doing that, you lose points you could have spent on others that are better: Heal, Protect, and Mind Trick.

[Alkonium]

I master all the light powers, then master lightning, making me a nearly invincible Jedi, immune to the Force and physical attacks, and strong in both.

[StaffSaberist]

You can't be both alignments in MP unless you have an uber-jedi hack/mod. In SP the enemy is weak anyway, doesn't matter if you only have core force. But in MP, you gotta be a little tougher.

[RobQel-Droma]

Does anyone know how many force points and/or vitality points reborn have? Because they sometimes cast force powers so many times (rage) that it is impossible for them to not die, or to have enough force points. It seems like they cheat.

I know, a bit off topic, but that always annoys me.

[StaffSaberist]

You can figure out their vitality in the SP game. Save your game and type:

playermodel reborn_new

You will become a reborn from JA and will have the same vitality, force, etc. But any former allies nearby will treat you as hostile, even if you go back by typing "playermodel player". So, load the save, and you can return to normal.

Wow, 1,000+ posts! Hat's off to you. I'm working on that.

[acdcfanbill]

Originally Posted by StaffSaberist

I thought if you were out of mana, it took your health. At least, I know that's happened to me a couple of times, when I was out of mana finishing a round of Absorb.

i'm pretty sure it works like that in SP, but in MP, i've never seen drain take hp, unless it was some mod your using. lots of mods tip the balance in lightsides favor, and i've seen many honor servers simply disable every darkside power except rage because they are 'lame'. so to note, everything i've stated is about basejka in MP

[Kurgan]

A lot of people get confused by Drain. Here is how it works (in basejka, as opposed to some wacky mod):

SP: Steals enemy's health and gives it to you. (and you can grab them at close range!)

MP: Steals enemy's Force mana and gives you health in exchange. (you can't grab them, period)

Also, IIRC in MP, we discovered through testing that if you drain somebody that has Absorb on, you don't steal mana, and I'm fairly sure the person using Absorb does get mana back (assuming they have a high enough level to completely counter the power).

I didn't really want to jump heavily into this debate since I'm not really much of a duelist, but when people say "bunny hopping" they mean rapid use of normal jump (not force jump) with strafing and running. So technically the act of "bunny hopping" itself doesn't use any mana.

[StaffSaberist]

i'm pretty sure it works like that in SP, but in MP, i've never seen drain take hp, unless it was some mod your using. lots of mods tip the balance in lightsides favor, and i've seen many honor servers simply disable every darkside power except rage because they are 'lame'. so to note, everything i've stated is about basejka in MP

So has mine. But, if I am wrong, ok. I guess I confused MP with SP. Hopefully, it won't happen again, feel free to /amslap me if I say something stupid like: "Katas don't root you to the spot!"

I didn't really want to jump heavily into this debate since I'm not really much of a duelist, but when people say "bunny hopping" they mean rapid use of normal jump (not force jump) with strafing and running. So technically the act of "bunny hopping" itself doesn't use any mana.

*realizes that even the Staff, with it's limited range, can reach that S-O-B if he looks up and primary fires*

That's kinda easy to counter, now that I think about it. And, if all else fails, hit 'em as they go up/come down.

[thehomicidalegg]

the point of bunnyhopping is to move extremely fast from 1 location to another - much faster than normal running, and unless you can strafe better than your opponent, you are not going to catch up and hit them when they come down.

[jedi_68]

Good Morning everyone

-I have just played JA in SP mode. I'm for the lightside of the force.

-I have played both LS and DS. Don't use much of the force powers, F1 thru F4 are the quick buttons you have.

- also their is less jedi to fight on the LS in the SP mode.

Have a good day!

[StaffSaberist]

Good morning! (I hate it to all heck when User CP doesn't show replies)

MP Force is a bit different, you know. Though I do agree to go LS.

the point of bunnyhopping is to move extremely fast from 1 location to another - much faster than normal running, and unless you can strafe better than your opponent, you are not going to catch up and hit them when they come down.

Or... Forward roll ahead of them, strafe, and hit them as they come at you. Not to mention, a quick Pull will bring them back to you, so you gan saber them. And, of course, if they are running away from you, you can whip out the Imperial Heavy Repeater, the Flechette, or any other gun to show them what happens to honorz saberists.

[acdcfanbill]

a roll is much slower, if you role, someone strafe jumping will go right past you.

[StaffSaberist]

Never noticed, I usally use Speed with rolls.

[mivoci1]

I prefer Force Grip and then lightsaber throw.Grip is for true darksiders if that fails no matter if he has absorb on or off finish him with lightsaber my opinion but Force Lightning whoa that does damage my favorite power are grip lightning drain dark rage and destrucution

[Anakin Skywalker]

I am going to have to go Dark Side of the Force; Lightning, Grip, Force Drain are the best Force Powers ever! The Power of the Dark Side is a wonderful thing that should be used to our advantage...... not to use it against us.

[Genral O]

Lightside.I rely on force heal alot!

[Anakin Skywalker]

^

Ahhh.... but with Force Drain, you can heal yourself, AND kill your opponents at the same time....

[StaffSaberist]

See, Heal gets more healed at a time. Plus, you don't need to be in range of an opponent to Heal. In the biz, we call that a "tactical withdrawal" or "0MFG MY H34l1h |z 4t f|\/e l3mm3 h34l!"

[Anakin Skywalker]

tush *clears throat....* I.... uhh..... mean tooshae....

Umm.... Still the Darksided power, can kill your opponents, that's why I usually have both LS and DS heal powers