Should the Jews be wiped out?

Nancy Allen`` · 07-26-2006, 04:53 PM

Given the hatred towards Israel I thought I would have this poll. Do you think we should finish what Hitler started and genocide the Jews, or they should be made to abandon Israel.

Personally I say no to both, but they still should be made to pay for their actions against Lebanon.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-26-2006, 05:00 PM

My IQ is two or three digits (never got it tested, but I kinda know it's more than 9), so no to both.

Tyrion · 07-26-2006, 05:01 PM

Totally, Jews need to be wiped out.

Along with the rest of humanity.

toms · 07-26-2006, 05:40 PM

The USA needs to butt out. And then the UN needs to go in with LARGE peacekeeping force and enforce an equal settlement on all sides.

Its not even that hard, if anyone had the will to do it.

kipperthefrog · 07-26-2006, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrion

Totally, Jews need to be wiped out.

Along with the rest of humanity.

Clicky!
http://objection.4camp.net/go.php?n=386135

TK-8252 · 07-26-2006, 07:10 PM

Pretty dumb thread, to be honest. No one, not even the Iranians, are calling for the genocide of the Jews (there are Persian Jews living in Iran without being slaughtered, albeit living as second-class citizens like the Arabs in Israel are living as second-class citizens).

I vote for the third option: give Palestine back. Then the Israelis can come to the USA and become powerful lobbyists and wealthy businessmen.

Samnmax221 · 07-26-2006, 07:16 PM

That's funny Ahmadinejad constantly talks about it all the time.

TK-8252 · 07-26-2006, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samnmax221

That's funny Ahmadinejad constantly talks about it all the time.

He talks about destroying Israel... but not all Jews in the world live in Israel. There is a big difference. No question he is a dumbass, but I don't think he's on the same level as Hitler.

Samnmax221 · 07-26-2006, 07:20 PM

Still Holocaust denial is incredibly asinine, the other people who deny the holocaust are neo-nazi's.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-26-2006, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TK-8252

Pretty dumb thread, to be honest.

Only as dumb as the people who post in it. Already somebody has put their money where their mouth is and support the 'Final Solution' for the Jews, and while I disagree with it I cannot blame them.

Tyrion · 07-26-2006, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kipperthefrog

Clicky!
http://objection.4camp.net/go.php?n=386135

You're assuming I'm human.

*hides third tentacle*

Pho3nix · 07-26-2006, 07:59 PM

Just banish religion alltogether. We'll be much better off.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-26-2006, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Already somebody has put their money where their mouth is and support the 'Final Solution' for the Jews, and while I disagree with it I cannot blame them.

I'd bet you anything it was a troll.

Tyrion · 07-26-2006, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nancy Allen``

Only as dumb as the people who post in it. Already somebody has put their money where their mouth is and support the 'Final Solution' for the Jews, and while I disagree with it I cannot blame them.

Okay, the only one in this thread who has said anything about killing all the Jews is me, so I should probably mention that what I said should not be taken seriously.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-26-2006, 11:01 PM

Maybe I should have made it a poll where we could see who has voted for what, although that way I think there'd be a lot fewer people who'd have the stones to vote, or vote what they really thought.

Hallucination · 07-27-2006, 12:37 AM

Do you mean the race or the religion?

Either way I say 'no'.

Datheus · 07-27-2006, 12:58 AM

My Jewish neighbor recently launched a missile attack on the Egyptian guy down the street. So let's go ahead and shove some of those Jews in Poland into ovens.

toms · 07-27-2006, 06:26 AM

Ok, if i was the UN (or god

) this is what i'd do:

1 - Cancel Israel.
2 - Use the massive ammount of money that is currently being used on the conflict to give every israeli citizen a bucket load of cash, and nationalisation in any UN country of their choice.
3 - Give the majority of israel back to the palestinian people and government, on the condition it has a democratic constitution.
(However be sensitive of any inter-tribal geography this time, not that i'm sure there is any).
4 - Make Jerusalem a UN protectorate. Make it like antarctica or the moon, a nation that belongs to all people of earth... under the management of the UN.

There... it'll never happen... and it would be a bit of a shock to 6million israelis if it did... but since only muslims are terrorists, not israelis they wouldn't fight back, and it would be a short, sharp shock after which everything would be solved, hpefully for the long term.

Its daft that for 100s of years the main religions seemed able to share jerusalem, but in a supposedly more modern and civilised society we can't get close to it.

And while it might seem impractical, i think that, IF THE POLITICIANS HAD HTE GUTS TO DO IT, it would be relatively straightforward to achieve. The US has so muich power over israel that they could basically force this implementation on them.

The world would be happy because it's major source of conflict would be solved. THe palestinians would be happy because they'd get their land back, the religins would be happy cos they'd all have equal access to jerusalem, Iran, Syria and Al Quaida would be unhappy as they'd loose their main source of support, the US would be happy because it wouldn't be so hated anymore, US citizens would be happy because they'd stop paying thousands of tax dollars to israel each year, and the israelis... well...

..i don't know if they'd be happy. but they'd be rich. They'd get to go anywhere they wanted inthe world and start again. The majoriy would probably go to the USA where they'd have enough money to do well. They wouldn't be under seige anymore, and they could always return to a neutral jerusalem whenever they wanted.

(Side note: the US gives about 1/3rd of its aid buget to israel each year, though israel is the 15th richest nation and has 0.01 of the world's population. The average isareli citizen therefore gets more aid per head than the average US citizen.. so they'd actually cost the US less, plus be putting money back int the US economy)

@Tyrion: its ok, i got you.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-27-2006, 06:30 AM

How about the same policy be conducted to Palestine, or North Korea? How about moving the Iraqi Insurgents on? They won't be happy but they'll be removed from where they would be killing the American invaders.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-27-2006, 09:42 AM

I don't think it's a good idea to remove Israel all-together. But then again, there are lots of other nice places on Earth for them where they can stay. Heck, give them the Yellowstone National Park or something

!

But to make Jerusalem a protectorate like Antarctica, probably guarded by a large number of UN troops - Now, there's an idea!

toms · 07-27-2006, 11:41 AM

Well, there isn't really anywhere for the palestinians to go.. that the whole problem. ANd moving north korea might be tricky. But as israel is only a newly created country, wherre all the population was flown in from other nations, it shouldn't be that hard to fly them all out again.

(Jewish 80.1% (Europe/America-born 32.1%, Israel-born 20.8%, Africa-born 14.6%, Asia-born 12.6%), non-Jewish 19.9% (mostly Arab) (1996 est.) )

And a lot of the israeli born ones would be kids who'd go with their parents. That might leave 15% or 900,000 people. I guess they could get a small district adjunct to the UN Protectorate of jerusalem.. or just all live in palestine, or go off to any country they want with a load of cash in their pocket.

I'm a genius...

CapNColostomy · 07-27-2006, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toms

The USA needs to butt out. And then the UN needs to go in with LARGE peacekeeping force and enforce an equal settlement on all sides.

Its not even that hard, if anyone had the will to do it.

Well, I guess that would be impossible considering how much money the USA pours into the UN. And a UN peacekeeping force? Don't make me laugh. How would you even have a UN peacekepping force without the USA?

toms · 07-27-2006, 05:24 PM

I thought the USA never paid its dues to the UN?? I'd put money on the fact it gives many times more money to israel than to the UN.

UN peacekeeping forces can be effective, IF they are given the support and mandate they need from the governments that matter (eg: the USA and maybe china or russia)

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-27-2006, 05:38 PM

Quote:

I thought the USA never paid its dues to the UN?

Which is another reason why the UN should not grant the US veto power.

Quote:

Well, I guess that would be impossible considering how much money the USA pours into the UN. And a UN peacekeeping force? Don't make me laugh. How would you even have a UN peacekepping force without the USA?

See, there are these other countries throughout the world. These other countries also have troops, believe it or not. As a matter of fact, the said troops even have guns and military training.

Comprende

?

Nancy Allen`` · 07-27-2006, 05:50 PM

Get the British SAS, the German Grenzschutzgruppe 9, Italian GIGN, Russian Spetznaz and others, the Polish GROM, Australia's SASR, the Greek MYK, I think all of these countries are part of the UN, and especially some of the more familiar of the special forces units such as GSG-9 are really up there with the best in the world. Only maybe America's Delta Force or SEALS are better.

*El Sitherino* · 07-28-2006, 01:04 AM

Just give back Palestine.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-29-2006, 07:38 PM

That's a pretty big question there, too. Should Israel retain what it has of Palestine? Should it give back so and so much? Should Israel just be declared a diplomatic failure and taken off the map?

I personally say don't remove Israel entirely. The Israelis are a nationality, and as such deserve a nation, just like the Englishmen, the Norwegians, the Chinese, and the Kurds (yes, I want them to get all of Kurdistan back, every inch of it). But leave most of it to Palestine, since they have, after all, lived there for 2000 years.

What's needed is a serious military presence. In Palestine, Jerusalem, South-Lebanon, and whatever other hot-spots present themselves nearby.

Which, of course, is impossible with armies fighting the "war on terror".

Nancy Allen`` · 07-29-2006, 07:42 PM

It's a legitimate war, going off to Iraq really had nothing to do with it apart from squashing a bug to take minds off the failure to get Bin Laden.

**Char Ell** · 07-30-2006, 01:22 PM

toms solution would work if the Israelis would go along with it. Problem is I don't think they would. There is this millenia-old attachment Israelis have for that particular patch of land.

And a UN peacekeeping force? It would only work if the Israelis are no longer in the area. Otherwise the Arab extremists are going to still find ways to go after them, peacekeeping force or no.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-30-2006, 07:06 PM

Quote:

toms' solution would work if the Israelis would go along with it. Problem is I don't think they would. There is this millenia-old attachment Israelis have for that particular patch of land.

I don't blame them. All nationalities are like that.

It sounds like some sort of Hollywood movie premise. Abandon your nationality and give up your country and get rich - or keep your country. Maybe I should set up a poll to see what people'd choose

. I'm pretty sure I'd choose to keep it.

*Kurgan* · 07-30-2006, 08:36 PM

Gee, is this thread anything more than flamebait and a false dilemma (either murder the Jews, or withdraw support from Israel)...

Shame on you Nancy Allen``, for breaking Godwin in the very first post and starting such a cynical thread. That others chose not to take the bait is a testament to the general level of civility in the Senate Chambers.

Had it not been for that I'd close the thread purely on principle.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-30-2006, 11:14 PM

This was not intended as flame bait, it was a genuine poll based on what I had seen people comment on around the forums and the Internet. I don't support the extermination of the Jews, but I will support people being allowed to air their views on whether or not they should or whether Israel should be handed back to Palestine.

Samnmax221 · 07-30-2006, 11:49 PM

THe title is extremely provacative, kind of like "Death at an early age" by Jonathan Kozol (Which unfortunetly my sociology teacher kept trying to jam down my throat all semester long). The entire topic could have been covered in the Israel/Lebbanon discussion.

Det. Bart Lasiter · 07-30-2006, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Insane Sith

Just give back Palestine.

I don't trust Palestinians anymore than I trust the Israelis.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-30-2006, 11:51 PM

I apologise if anyone is upset by it but I checked the rules and as far as I could tell there was no problem with it.

**SkinWalker** · 07-31-2006, 12:52 AM

I must say that I agree with Kurgan on the trollish nature of the thread. Obviously the title and the poll where intended to provoke a response. Im not opposed to using a provocative topic, but theres a fine line between trolling and provoking discussion. Comments thus far have been civil, so I'm inclined to leave the thread open for now.

Clearly, the poll was, as Kurgan pointed out, a false dilemma. Obviously, we shouldn't "genocide" the Jews (using genocide as a verb is a little awkward) regardless of what our feelings are regarding the situation. The terrorist actions on both sides are deplorable and whatever action should be taken by outside authorities (UN, U.S., etc.) should be taken without bias -though this will obviously not happen. There's simply too much political influence on the side of the Israeli government in the United States than there is the Palestinian or Lebanese. Moreover, most Americans identify Palestinians as antagonists and Israelis as protagonists -in spite of the fact that there are still those alive in Palestine and Israel that recall the forced eviction of their homeland after WWII in order to establish the invented nation of Israel.

Let me mention at this time that I don't need anyone pretending to give me a history lesson about how Israel was a nation long ago, yada, yada. I've more knowledge of the history of the Levant as evidenced in the archaeological record in a boil on my tush than most think they have in their brains. Not only that, but it's also a waste of time, since I also don't think evicting the Israelis is a viable option at this time either. But it is helpful for us in the sheltered west to realize that there are feelings and points of view *in* the Levant that we can't hope to understand fully without walking in the shoes of both Palestinians and Israelis.

Having said that, clearly, both sides are stupid and callous since neither side has any qualms about murdering the children and innocents of the other side -a characteristic of evil by any standard of the word.

Our best course of action is probably to completely ignore the issue altogether. Screw 'em. Don't send another dime's worth of goods or services to either side. Don't allow any travel to or from the region. Don't allow any trade with either.

We simply shouldn't be friendly with terrorists. Period.

With regard to the two who chose the "genocide" option, its unlikely that this is the actual desire of those that chose it. More likely, they are simply fed up with the news coming from the region as well as the futility of being involved with Israeli and Palestinian terrorists or hoping that one terrorist faction will cease fire.

The poll is locked.

Nancy Allen`` · 07-31-2006, 01:02 AM

That's probably for the best, as people can vote 'yes' anonymously and such. Like I said I wasn't trying to upset people with the thread and I apologise to anyone who was. But thankfully we have had some fruitful discussion in the thread.

Dagobahn Eagle · 07-31-2006, 01:48 PM

Quote:

That others chose not to take the bait is a testament to the general level of civility in the Senate Chambers.

Very true. That this thread didn't turn into a flame-fight speaks novels about how civil this forum is. Kudos.

Good Sir Knight · 07-31-2006, 04:15 PM

I'm back guys and in my opinion this thread is reprehensible.

The fact that the question is even brought up is anti-semetic at best, there should never be a debate on whether an entire race of people should be exterminated.

Shame on you.

Oh and if I might add one fact, Hezbolla targets civilians and celebrate the deaths of women and children.

Hellfire Jedi · 07-31-2006, 04:16 PM

oh wow, what a ****ing offensive thread. what was going on in your mind when you made it?