Tech News and Gossip thread...

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

Or if you'd rather get a new PC instead of a house, sell your current one and buy one of these...Seriously, £375,000BGP ($740,000USD) for it and all you get is a 7200GS!!! *speechless*

Im sure P-Diddy has one of those.... Youd think they couldve upped the price and thrown in an 8800GT at least...a 7200 is crap! Still, for someone that is that vain and rich, playing 1337 Crysis probably isnt on their list of to-dos

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

More news peeps:

S3 and VIA making S3 Graphics DX10.1 GPUs
^ I find it extremely ironic to make DX10.1 GPUs with a 64-bit memory interface for the low-end market where you'll be using DX10.1 about as much as a rabbit uses toilet paper...Even the high end can't take DX10 to it's full potential, so why put these features on cards that'll never use them?

Here's a thought, let NVidia buy AMD, yay!
^ Seriously, wtf? How will this help anyone besides Intel as it'll make their stuff more attractive and less confusing if the do end up taking on the high-end GPU market...

AMD says APU is the way to go
^ Way to go and tell Intel what to do again, why can't they just keep their mouths shut and actually make the bloody things instead of yapping about it and letting Intel take all the credit when they release a better and sooner version of it...
It does all seem very promising though, but will it be enough to keep them alive in the next couple of years?

GPGPUs are the way to go as well apparently
^ Seems like the CPU and GPU are coming closer together indeed, and I think it's just a matter of time before a company releases a hybrid so purely awesome that it will eliminate the need for both and effectively merge all our processing power in one, whether it be graphics or number crunching...

[Astrotoy7]

Yes. CnGPUs are the future, no doubt, and apart from the server market will keep AMDs Processors on the map, no matter how the early phenoms go

no, nvidia buying AMD(ATI) will effectively create a monopoly and no one wants that !

keep up the great work negsun

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

hehe, will do Astro

Microsoft giving away free stuff for students (damn those students!)
^ Quite cool cause all those programs would cost you a small fortune in retail...I didn't know Bill Gates was stepping down either...

Triple-Core Phenoms in sight?
^ And quite cheap too, if rumours are to be believed, here's hoping AMD sorted out that L3 cache problem and give us some decent performance at a really low price...Call me Mr Cynical but the fact that they're showing up in Mesh PCs doesn't exactly fill me with confidence.

Agressive price cuts from AMD to counter nVidia's 9 Series
^ If the HD3850/3870s weren't insane bargains before, they sure as hell are now, especially since some leaked benchies show that the 9600GT isn't exactly up to spec with even the 8800GT, and I'm liking the joke that goes around saying that Ati did the 9600 years ago and mastered it then

[Char Ell]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

Agressive price cuts from AMD to counter nVidia's 9 Series
^ If the HD3850/3870s weren't insane bargains before, they sure as hell are now, especially since some leaked benchies show that the 9600GT isn't exactly up to spec with even the 8800GT, and I'm liking the joke that goes around saying that Ati did the 9600 years ago and mastered it then

From what I've read about the 9600 GT so far I am poised to be greatly disappointed in NVIDIA's newest mainstream card. Still no DirectX 10.1 support? Simply no excuse for that. I'll wait and see what comes out tomorrow before I pass final judgment but right now the 9600 GT isn't looking all that great to me.

[Rogue Nine]

Intel Price Cuts Coming April 20th

And here I was hoping they'd slash the E8400's price just a bit. xD

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Char Ell

Still no DirectX 10.1 support? Simply no excuse for that.

lolz. Who is using 10.1? DX10 only games are barely coming together... I dont see that many devs have embraced 10.1... I daresay the SDK has been finalised in any event.

So apart from 'wank factor'(bragging you have a 10.1 card) the practicality of it really doesnt warrant such rampant disappointment

A card's success is made or broken on its benchies vs price. Simple

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

Originally Posted by Rogue Nine

Intel Price Cuts Coming April 20th

And here I was hoping they'd slash the E8400's price just a bit. xD

Ouch, if the Q6600 G0 wasn't extreme value for money before, it's more than that now!

[Char Ell]

Samsung apparently is putting a lot of R&D into SSD technology

On another topic, Yang cited explosive demand in the enterprise server market that caught his company by surprise. "At first it just sounded like an interesting idea," he said. But then demand took off. As Yang explained, companies like Citibank and American Express peg server performance on IOPS or input/output operations per second. "HDDs do 120 to 150 IOPS. SSDs 10,000 to 30,000 IOPS." Because of this overwhelming speed advantage many large corporate customers are opting for SSDs, despite the significant price premium SSDs command compared with HDDs.

Regarding cost, Yang expects to see a 35 percent to 45 percent year-to-year drop in SSD prices. This will be a welcome relief since 64GB SSDs currently can add as much as $900 to the price of a notebook PC.

In the third quarter, Samsung is slated to bring out a 128GB SSD based on MLC (multi-level cell) technology--which uses multiple levels per cell to allow more bits to be stored. But the company sees even larger-capacity SSDs, ranging all the way up to 250GB, possibly before the end of the year.

Source: CNET

Maybe this means I'll be able to afford a SSD next year.

[Negative Sun]

I can't wait for SSDs to become cheaper cause they pwn current HDDs in pretty much every way...

Here's some news that's on pretty much every tech site now:
Intel making 6-Core 45nm Penryn CPUs!
^ What else can I say but: Ouch!

CrossFireX preview
^ Up to 3X more improvement can be a good thing I suppose, especially at those ultra high resolutions (2,560x1,600) that only some wackos would ever use

[stingerhs]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

Here's some news that's on pretty much every tech site now:
Intel making 6-Core 45nm Penryn CPUs!
^ What else can I say but: Ouch!

my problem with more and more cores on a processor is simply this: most software is still single-threaded. without a lot of multithreaded apps out there, adding more and more cores to a CPU isn't going to add a lot of performance. IMHO, the only great thing about the hex-core is the insane amount of L2 and L3 cache. with that much cache on hand, those processors are going to be faster than the current quad-cores.

[tk102]

Originally Posted by stingerhs

most software is still single-threaded. without a lot of multithreaded apps out there, adding more and more cores to a CPU isn't going to add a lot of performance.

Of course the OS will still load balance multiple single-threaded applications across the multiple cores. But you're right, going from 1/4 thread load to 1/6 thread load is less impressive than dropping the load by 1/2 by switching from single to dual-core or dropping from 1/2 to 1/4 via quad core.

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

... Up to 3X more improvement can be a good thing I suppose, especially at those ultra high resolutions (2,560x1,600) that only some wackos would ever use

c'mon negsun, envy is not good for your soul...you know you want such a monitor. I saved for a year to get it and it was worth it indeed Thoigh somewhere in my mind, I will eventually contemplate a 40" version but would prefer OLED because of size/weight/less power.

Its good to see your eyes are opening to the benefits of SLI/XF, though being a power efficiency nut and Im unlikely to ever go for it, unless they make ultra efficient single pcb cards that will fit in an SLI smallform.... (Im shudder to think at the cost of such a setup, especially with x4/DDR3 added in)

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

Originally Posted by Astrotoy7

cmon negsun, envy is not good for your soul...you know you want such a monitor. I saved for a year to get it and it was worth it indeed

lolz, 30" or whatever you've got is a bit too big for me dude, after seeing a very nice 22" panel in action, the Samsung SyncMaster 2232-BW, I'm sure it'll be more than sufficient enough for me, it's very pretty plus it won't need a monster of a GPU if I fancy doing some gaming

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

lolz, 30" or whatever you've got is a bit too big for me dude.....

impossible!! you can never have too big a screen I want one of those LCD walls damnit [/screen junkie]

mtfbwya

[stingerhs]

well, some interesting news from the Inquirer today. they were allowed to run a 3DMark06 benchmark on the upcoming GeForce 9800 GX2 with what is supposed to be the stock speeds. problem is that its putting up a modest 14400 score. if that's the case, then the 3870X2 could remain the top card for a while until ATI overtakes themselves with the upcoming R780-based cards.

granted, you do have to take this news with a grain of salt since we don't know what the rest of the hardware is on the system they used, but a 14400 score just isn't all that much better than ye ol' 8800 GTX.

article here

[Negative Sun]

It did strike me as odd that they released the lower-end version before their new flagship card, but if that's even close to what their next flagship's gonna be then I feel bad for their fleet
It'll get a pummeling from AMD/Ati price/performance wise, especially with all the aggressive price cuts AMD is churning out these days...The 8800GT is pretty much all that nVidia has going for them these days.

[stingerhs]

AMD sticks it to Intel via integrated graphics
AMD's new 780G mobo's are something serious. it has integrated graphics, but this one doesn't suck as per the norm. the integrated chip is sourced from a Radeon 2400, and it gives you excellent HD playback and reasonable gaming performance which is a far cry from just about every other integrated graphics solution i can think of. combine this with Hybrid Crossfire, and you can have a pretty darn good gaming rig. oh, and i dare not mention the insane overclocking headroom on this thing...

[Q]

Originally Posted by stingerhs

well, some interesting news from the Inquirer today. they were allowed to run a 3DMark06 benchmark on the upcoming GeForce 9800 GX2 with what is supposed to be the stock speeds. problem is that its putting up a modest 14400 score. if that's the case, then the 3870X2 could remain the top card for a while until ATI overtakes themselves with the upcoming R780-based cards.

granted, you do have to take this news with a grain of salt since we don't know what the rest of the hardware is on the system they used, but a 14400 score just isn't all that much better than ye ol' 8800 GTX.

article here

That's odd. I've seen 3DMark06 scores like that from a single overclocked 8800GT.

[Negative Sun]

Originally Posted by stingerhs

AMD sticks it to Intel via integrated graphics
AMD's new 780G mobo's are something serious. it has integrated graphics, but this one doesn't suck as per the norm. the integrated chip is sourced from a Radeon 2400, and it gives you excellent HD playback and reasonable gaming performance which is a far cry from just about every other integrated graphics solution i can think of. combine this with Hybrid Crossfire, and you can have a pretty darn good gaming rig. oh, and i dare not mention the insane overclocking headroom on this thing...

You could slap in one of those fancy HD3870 on Vapour cooling that Sapphire is making and have a very cool, energy efficient Hybrid Crossfire pwnage machine for very little money...
All that's left is an extremely OC'able CPU from AMD and we're in business

Though I'm quite interested in that 4850e they're talking about...Or the Phenom that can OC to 2.8Ghz, I though they couldn't go that high.

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by stingerhs

AMD sticks it to Intel via integrated graphics
AMD's new 780G mobo's are something serious. it has integrated graphics, but this one doesn't suck as per the norm.

ooh yum! the htpc crowd are very excited about this one. Intels highest is GMA 960, which whilst OK for 720i/pp, still will struggle on a 1080i/p display(especially for vista). nvidias highest integrated chipset was 7200(or 7300) last I checked = bollocks for 1080i/p

see good ole AMD, full o damn surprises. I shouldnt be too surprised, AMD has previously announced they were edging into the HTPC market, and have previously shown off prototype AMD branded entire htpcs no less. Of course they also have firmly established their AMD Live suite as well, which is aimed at the htpc crowd and includes Orb(remote access to TV), network magic, the best networking proggie in the world!

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

AMD gets their 45nm act together...

Interesting stuff, let's just hope they've learned their lesson and deliver, preferably when promised

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

AMD gets their 45nm act together...

Interesting stuff, let's just hope they've learned their lesson and deliver, preferably when promised

Im sure people wouldnt mind the delay if the delievered product was bug free, well priced and performs according to peoples expectations.

mtfbwya

[stingerhs]

Pricing for the GeForce 9800GX2 revealed

well, it now looks like the GF9800 GX2 is going to be a bust. i mean, come on, the MSRP is at $599, and you had better not think that the figure isn't going to get larger when the manufacturers start adding in OC'd versions, exotic cooling, etc. and to top it off, performance is only slightly better than the R3870X2 which can be had for about $450. heck, you could probably get a 3870 and a 3870X2 for the same price and get much better performance.

IMHO, the 9800GX2 is looking to be more and more of a debacle for Nvidia. their only saving grace is the 9600 which is just slightly worse than the 8800GT in performance and costs about the same as a R3850. for now, i'm standing by my prediction that the upcoming R770 launch from AMD is going to put them ahead for the first time since the days of the 9700 Pro and the FX5700 Ultra.

[Negative Sun]

^ Drivers could still be their saving grace though, and full-AA Crysis benchies as it seems to be a weak spot for Ati cards there...But I agree, at that price point you'd expect the GX2 to blow everything else out the water, with at least a 20-25% increase in performance over its closest follower, as it is the difference in price...


OCZ goes sci-fi with commercial brain controller
^ lolz, ain't no way I'm putting that on my head for $300

Intel wants some integrated GPU action!
^ But will probably get none as AMD totally pwns this chipset, and if they can just throw us some good CPUs in as well they might start their long road back to the top again
Intel getting beaten by AMD? Oh dear, let's hope there's more of that to come...

AMD sticks new chipset in "Puma" laptop and pwns Intel (again, lolz)
^ Good to see them translating that awesomeness into laptops as well, and if it's decently priced they'll definitely have a winner on their hands.

[Char Ell]

I read this the other day on bit-tech

So, given that G94 uses the same technology as G92 – just with less of it, you're probably wondering why the GeForce 9600 GT isn't a part of a the GeForce 8-series? The good thing is that this was a question that was on our minds too and, after talking with Ujesh Desai, General Manager for GeForce graphics, at the CES Editor's Day, we were told that the reason was because the G92-based products should have been a part of the GeForce 9-series – the reason they weren't was simply down to timing.

He explained that if Nvidia had launched the GeForce 8800 GT and GeForce 8800 GTS 512 into the GeForce 9-series, it would have killed a large portion of its Q4 sales on products in the GeForce 8-series – not that this didn't happen anyway, since there is very little else worth considering...

So I guess this means the rumors of the 8800 GT getting some clock speed boosts and getting rebadged as 9800 GT will likely turn out to be true.

[Q]

I smell an opportunity for AMD to pull ahead with R7xx if they learned from mistakes made with R6xx. We all know that they can do it.

AMD so desperately needs a win.

EDIT -3/14/08: Well, this is a start, but I have my doubts as to whether Phenom will ever be competitive with C2D, even with the TLB bug fixed.

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Qliveur

I smell an opportunity for AMD to pull ahead with R7xx if they learned from mistakes made with R6xx. We all know that they can do it.

AMD so desperately needs a win.

EDIT -3/14/08: Well, this is a start, but I have my doubts as to whether Phenom will ever be competitive with C2D, even with the TLB bug fixed.

Even if they pull almost even, with competitive pricing, will still do well. The CPU ceiling seen in benchies is here to stay until games are quad and x64 optimised> ie. another 2 years at least... add to that 2 year formula, enough time for bluray to become standard kit and all the ingredients will be there.

Of course by then, the current hardware configs might be thrown out the window(no pun intended) if the awesome idea of CnGPUs take off. I relish the day when discrete graphics cards will be no longer. All our pcs will look like funky gaming consoles

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

AMD RV770 here soon?
^ Ooh goodie I can't wait, hope it pwns and they've learned from the HD2000 debacle
I really think AMD/Ati's product release schedules suffered greatly from the merger and Intel and nVidia didn't just sit around for them to get it all on track, so hopefully we'll see tighter releases with some killer products more often in the future from them...

[stingerhs]

well, i've said it once and i'll say it again: the R770 is looking much more promising at the moment than the stuff coming down Nvidia's pipeline. granted, we don't know much about it, but considering that its a brand new architecture that's "better" than the current R6xx series, it should at the least outperform Nvidia's latest which barely outpaces the current R6xx stuff.

combine one of those with a 780G board in hybrid Xfire...

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

Here's another wee update:
Asus to make PDA/Smartphone

Asus have been in the WinMobile game since WM 2003 at least. I know this for a fact because 2 years ago I had a ASUS p505 which was running WM2003. I actually sold it to my stepdau..who promptly busted it within 6 months.. kids



I've never been a fan of the chopped-down smartphone variants, but would be totally lost without my WM6 pda. I use it to keep track of personal and work appts, contacts. The fact that it syncs with outlook for all this is invaluable for me. Winmobile 6 is ok, though not a huge step up from WM5, though it looks like MS is doing some major overhaulin for WM7.

WMDC(window mobile device center) on vista is great, a superior improvement over MS activesync(xp and earlier)

Might even be worth waiting for the WM7 generation phones negsun??

I have HTC touch, which I love the look and feel of. Whilst I manage ok for what I use it for, I recommend people get the dual core version, coz its quicker, and more effectively used as a mobile media device than the first gen version Ive got.

Easily the best site to keep track of all things WM and smartphone is 4winmobile. As it's a UK site, all of the stuff about contracts and carriers they may mention will be relevant to you negsun(much less so to me!) I used to be a reg at their forums but only have time to lurk here nowdays

mtfbwya

[Rogue Nine]

Aaaaand the GeForce 9800 X2 is out.

Now where are the benchies?!

[Q]

Meh, those dual-GPU cards are just like SLI/X-fire setups in that they're hit-or-miss.

They'll excel in some games, suck in others, and be mediocre in the rest.

Not nearly worth $600.00 if you ask me.

Hell, you can get 2 8800GTS 512s and an 780i SLI motherboard for less than that.*


*Okay, well, almost.

[Astrotoy7]

GX2s are too damn powerhungry IMO Being a former GX2 owner I should know!

Even though a 9800GX2 made 47FPS on 2500x1600 on med in crysis, Im not going near em with a barge pole.. Two 8800GTX in SLI performed slightly less better and the 3870GX2 was thoroughly trounced in HD/UHD ...tsk tsk ATI..

Conclusion: expensive to buy, expensive to run, but is currently the fastest hunk o junk in the galaxy.

the benchies are always at G3D of course
http://www.guru3d.com/article/Videocards/512/

mtfbwya

[Negative Sun]

Originally Posted by Astrotoy7

I've never been a fan of the chopped-down smartphone variants, but would be totally lost without my WM6 pda. I use it to keep track of personal and work appts, contacts. The fact that it syncs with outlook for all this is invaluable for me. Winmobile 6 is ok, though not a huge step up from WM5, though it looks like MS is doing some major overhaulin for WM7.

WMDC(window mobile device center) on vista is great, a superior improvement over MS activesync(xp and earlier)

Might even be worth waiting for the WM7 generation phones negsun??

I have HTC touch, which I love the look and feel of. Whilst I manage ok for what I use it for, I recommend people get the dual core version, coz its quicker, and more effectively used as a mobile media device than the first gen version Ive got.

Easily the best site to keep track of all things WM and smartphone is 4winmobile. As it's a UK site, all of the stuff about contracts and carriers they may mention will be relevant to you negsun(much less so to me!) I used to be a reg at their forums but only have time to lurk here nowdays

Cheers for that site Astro! Some good reviews on there, especially the HTC Touch one which I'm interested in.

It's a really hard choice for me, and the end of my current contract comes near and I still haven't found my favorite choice of Phone/smartphone/PDA yet...There's some nice offers from Samsung (F700), Nokia (N91 8GB) and Sony Ericsson (W960 8GB), as well as the HTC Touch you've mentioned which looks awesome too...I'm leaning more towards the 8GB ones, as a music lover, but since flash memory prices are crumbling fast, I expect to see more phones or even Smartphones/PDAs to show up with loads more storage like that.



There's some interesting bits going on in news-land as well:

IBM develops optical switch for multi-core CPUs
^ I just read an article in a magazine about this technology (which Intel will probably steal and make better ), and it seems like a logical, but also very effective evolution in CPU architecture, can't wait to see it implemented

Intel reveals (a bit) more about Larrabee
^ Seems interesting enough, but will it translate into good graphics performance under both DX10 and OpenGL? Time will tell...

Another 9800GX2 review
^ Except for Crysis pwnage or ultra high resolutions I wouldn't touch this monster with a ten foot pole, and like the 3870X2, it doesn't add any significant innovations to the GPU market, except reduce the need for a special mobo if you want to use Sli/CrossFire.

Nehalem = Phenom ???
^ Very interesting read, maybe the next generation CPUs might battle on a bit more even ground this way? Doesn't surprise me one bit coming from Intel though

Roll out some more Phenom, 9750 B3 stepping is good to go apparently
^ Finally, lets see if they can stop blaming the TLB error and squeeze some clock speeds outta this sucker!

[urluckyday]

Yeah...Vista SP1 Out today...download it. It makes great even better!

(and I am being serious...don't hate me...)

[Astrotoy7]

All I can say urluckyday is....backup! A few of my hometheatre pc peeps were getting the dreaded endless reboot after SP1(RC of course). I doubt they have 100% of the bugs worked out

No need to get a snazzy backup proggie either(before Ray and negsun poke at me about it)...but if you have vista ulti..it's backup and restore center has a full system backup option. Works ok, but compression of backups is far less effective than other proggies(by 80%) !! lolz

@negsun >> ive already said it > but if you are going for the HTC Touch, dont get single core version... get the Duo!
................remember..........remember........ remember

btw negsun, heard of the budget priced shuttle....the kpc?? Looks interesting indeed. Basic specs, but can chuck yer own junk in it. But, I think its an intel only dealie The specs are almost identical to my home theatre pc, which is great because more people can use a shuttle for this without paying an arm and a leg.

mtfbwya

[urluckyday]

Well, I just bought this comp., and so I don't have much to back-up...and SP1 worked perfectly anyway..

[Negative Sun]

Originally Posted by Astrotoy7

@negsun >> ive already said it > but if you are going for the HTC Touch, dont get single core version... get the Duo!
................remember..........remember........ remember

Will do, though I can't get it with my favorite mobile provider, which kinda sucks :/

Originally Posted by Astrotoy7

btw negsun, heard of the budget priced shuttle....the kpc?? Looks interesting indeed. Basic specs, but can chuck yer own junk in it. But, I think its an intel only dealie The specs are almost identical to my home theatre pc, which is great because more people can use a shuttle for this without paying an arm and a leg.

Yeah, the case looks utterly awesome, but that's where the fun ends....No PCI-E and cr*ppy Intel graphics and processor, no Wi-Fi (come on, they can throw it in cheap laptops nowadays, it's not too much to ask IMO), no optical drive (rendering it pretty useless as a home theatre PC if you ask me), etc...

For the price though, it's not too bad I suppose, if there was an AMD alternative with maybe just a single PCI-E expansion slot, an optical drive and some Wi-Fi support, I might consider veering towards it

[Astrotoy7]

Originally Posted by Negative Sun

Yeah, the case looks utterly awesome, but that's where the fun ends....No PCI-E and cr*ppy Intel graphics and processor, no Wi-Fi (come on, they can throw it in cheap laptops nowadays, it's not too much to ask IMO), no optical drive (rendering it pretty useless as a home theatre PC if you ask me), etc...

lolz... the pci-e is the main sticking point for many.(because dual HDTV tuners work best in pci-e) But unless you are a bluray fan, having an optical drive in a htpc is far from a necessity. I dont have one! who the heck watches actual DVDs these days!! For fresh installs etc I have an external drive, the rest is done over remote desktop connection. I use the 5.25 bay to fit another 1TB drive in >> far more useful!!

Im going to wait til they float towards Oz..and see if I can do a basic(non 1080i/p) rig for a htpc before I start recommending them to clients/friends en masse.

* * *

On the news front:

Here's some sad news for those following the fortunes of AMD..
AMD to Lay off 5% of workforce > which amounts to about 800 workers This is one area where theyre glad not to beat intel, with their 10,000 worker cull

Vista SP1 Early Adopters > Please school up before you install
The Vista Team Blog on SP1

HD-DVD will cost Toshiba and Partners(like MS) 1 billion
Summary article from engadget, and for the money minded Toshiba Financial Statement

Whilst there is a part of me that is glad to see the back of HD-DVD, that sum of money being squandered is tragic IMO. I hope manufacturers learn from it

also, a tee-hee from me to anyone who is thinking of buying a 9800GX2
Heat from GeForce 9800 GX2 causing system crashes? Really, are we that surprised....??

mtfbwya