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View Poll Results: What are the most annoying things in TSL? -Please only pick 3 max Story not included-
Hard to kill Vrook? 3 7.89%
Not enough Force point regeneration? 1 2.63%
Not enough FP's for Jedi Guardians? 2 5.26%
Nihilus too weak? 26 68.42%
Shem's mod that kills people at LV 1? 1 2.63%
Sion being near immortal? 5 13.16%
Voters: 38. You may not vote on this poll


Thread: DID you know that...(TSL discussion)
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Old 05-02-2008, 10:42 AM   #1
Wedge Suron
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DID you know that...(TSL discussion)

I'm wondering.

Sorry, this is a repost.




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Old 05-02-2008, 11:08 AM   #2
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You didn't include Story? I'll have to go with Kreia, Sion, Nihilus, Bao dur, goto, Peragus, Citadel station, Telos, Prequel era Robes and the Exile then


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Old 05-02-2008, 11:10 AM   #3
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Then pick Sion option, or the Nihilus post. I meant it to be multi option.




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Old 05-02-2008, 12:22 PM   #4
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I picked Nihilus being too weak, because none of the other options really annoyed me.
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Old 05-02-2008, 01:14 PM   #5
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Nihilus being a sissy.

The whole Telos and having to replay Peragus.

Bugs...
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamqd
You didn't include Story?
Well, shame. It was on my top 3 worst.


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Old 05-02-2008, 02:05 PM   #6
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I really was annoyed at the fact of Shem's super enhanced mod. It's damn impossible to live past the first two droids, unless you know how. But I found Vrook more annoying.




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Old 05-02-2008, 10:05 PM   #7
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Would probably be Nihilus for me, because I didn't notice any of the others to be particularly annoying and I don't do mods.


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Old 05-02-2008, 10:19 PM   #8
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I'd have to say Sion, because I had to repeatedly use Battle Meditation and Force Heal to keep up with his pace.

It was extremely tedious.

Though Nihilus was too easy as well. That got me annoyed, too.


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Old 05-02-2008, 11:25 PM   #9
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Nihlius for me. None of the others bothered me that much... Sion is easy as long as you know how to 'hide' your prescence by hiding behind a pillar.
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Old 05-02-2008, 11:28 PM   #10
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I thought both Sion and Nihilus were equally too easy. Maybe it was easier because I was a guardian with upgraded armor/lightsaber? I had no problem with either one.
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Old 05-03-2008, 01:58 AM   #11
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Nihilus being a bit of a weakling was on my list, but Vrook DID give me some problems throughout gameplay. I never needed to use mines (perhaps you were thinking of grenades?) it's just that he can kill you so easily, and constantly refills his life.


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Old 05-03-2008, 11:07 AM   #12
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DID you know that...(TSL discussion)

1. The Medical bay and the Czerka offices on Telos are actually the same room just with different things in and in different areas? - You find out that if you have the opendoor power from handy force powers mod -

2. That Atton Rand wasn't supposed to originally be in TSL? He was meant to be in JK JA.

3. That the Exchange suite looks like a redress of the Ithorian Compound? - This is my opininon -

4. Sion is a right pain to kill? - lol, I hate the guy so don't expect a nice word about him, unless I'm stating info. Pun lol, Pain to kill, Sion's the Lord of Pain -

5. Kreia is a right pain in the tushy? - She's nearly impossible to please, unless it goes against moral ethics. Not starting on the fact, she's bloody stuck at Grey Level. Yet she's a Sith Lord -

6. That there are no feats to bloody increase FPs on Jedi Guardians? - I have posts asking for a mod to do it, but no one will take it up -




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Old 05-03-2008, 12:51 PM   #13
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The name Atton was supposed to be in JK, not the character.


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Old 05-03-2008, 02:45 PM   #14
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Sir...Jedi Guardian aren't supposed to do the Force powers...They got most feat, while Jedi Consular get most Force Powers...So that might explain why Jedi Guardian has insufficient FP...

In layman's terms, Jedi guardian is like shredder. Jedi Consular is like Inspirer, I think...




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Old 05-03-2008, 04:19 PM   #15
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FP - Force Points.




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Old 05-03-2008, 04:29 PM   #16
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They don't get much of those, either. If you want more, pick a different class. :P Or you could spend a feat on Regenerate Force Points and boost your Wisdom.


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Old 05-03-2008, 06:15 PM   #17
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Yes I did know....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
1. The Medical bay and the Czerka offices on Telos are actually the same room just with different things in and in different areas? - You find out that if you have the opendoor power from handy force powers mod -
Its part of the same space station... which was probably built in quite a hurry due to Telos being somewhat deaded by Malak. So it would seem much like some shopping malls where all the shops have the same structure; the space station was the same. That or Obsidian didn't have that fine attention to detail, and had a rushed production schedule. I like to think its the former rather than the latter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
2. That Atton Rand wasn't supposed to originally be in TSL? He was meant to be in JK JA.
That fact is so 2005 and...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TK-001
The name Atton was supposed to be in JK, not the character.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
3. That the Exchange suite looks like a redress of the Ithorian Compound? - This is my opininon -
A thread entitled 'Did you know' would indicate it has a set of sustatiated fact, nor conjecture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
4. Sion is a right pain to kill? - lol, I hate the guy so don't expect a nice word about him, unless I'm stating info. Pun lol, Pain to kill, Sion's the Lord of Pain -
He's a Sith Lord, he's not exactly up there with Jar Jar Binks in the easy to kill category...

Although, I didn't actually think he was hard to beat, especially on Malachor, a speed flurry would normally do him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
5. Kreia is a right pain in the tushy? - She's nearly impossible to please, unless it goes against moral ethics. Not starting on the fact, she's bloody stuck at Grey Level. Yet she's a Sith Lord -
Isn't that the point of her charachter?

Do not diss Kreia, I will set Nietzsche on you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
6. That there are no feats to bloody increase FPs on Jedi Guardians? - I have posts asking for a mod to do it, but no one will take it up -
Why would you want to increase FP's on a Guardian, why wouldn't you just go a Consular?

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Last edited by Jae Onasi; 05-03-2008 at 07:41 PM. Reason: changed language in a quote
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Old 05-03-2008, 07:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan7
A thread entitled 'Did you know' would indicate it has a set of sustatiated fact, nor conjecture.
It is true, though. The Exchange base is a complete copy of the Ithorian compound, just Czerka is a copy of the medical unit (except for the mainframe).


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Old 05-03-2008, 08:16 PM   #19
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Moved thread from the Unknown Regions to Telos Tourist Bureau since this is about TSL and not a potential Kotor 3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
6. That there are no feats to bloody increase FPs on Jedi Guardians? - I have posts asking for a mod to do it, but no one will take it up -
Guardians are supposed to be melee characters and put all their Force knowledge into fighting, hence the reason why they don't have as many force powers or points.

There's no need to make a mod for it, that's why no one's taken the job. You can a. pick a class that has more Force points, b. increase your Wisdom, which will increase your Force points, c. use the Regenerate Force Points feat which will make them regenerate faster, d. Use the Force Affinity power, e. Use the Force Body power, f. Use the Force channel power, g. use the Kasha crystal to increase Wisdom, h. use the Qixoni crystal to increase Force point regeneration, i. use the Kaiburr crystal to increase Wisdom, and/or j.Use the Kotor Savegame editor to increase your Force point pool. Please don't complain no one's helping you with a mod when it looks like you haven't explored all the options the game has to offer for you to achieve what you want.


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Old 05-04-2008, 01:26 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
4. Sion is a right pain to kill? - lol, I hate the guy so don't expect a nice word about him, unless I'm stating info. Pun lol, Pain to kill, Sion's the Lord of Pain -

5. Kreia is a right pain in the tushy? - She's nearly impossible to please, unless it goes against moral ethics. Not starting on the fact, she's bloody stuck at Grey Level. Yet she's a Sith Lord -
4) I agree, though I didn't neccassarily find him hard to kill, I mean it's easy not to die while fighting him - it's just that it's extremely tedious, and it takes a long time.

5) Seriously! If you do Dark Side, she criticises you, and if you do light side she yells at you.


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Old 05-04-2008, 10:30 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Spitfire
5) Seriously! If you do Dark Side, she criticises you, and if you do light side she yells at you.
I think there's a point to that though, since you open up conversations with her whether you gain influence up to 90% or lose it down to 10%. That way you can get down to 10% (or lower) whether you're DS or LS.
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Old 05-05-2008, 02:08 PM   #22
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I had a hard time beating Vrook, but that was no where near as annoying as Nihilus being a complete weakling. One time I defeated him with three flurry attacks (granted my character was a high level guardian). I thought he was supposed to be like this super powerful sith lord.
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Old 05-05-2008, 02:14 PM   #23
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Voted for Nihilus, because the others aren't really annoying, since there are easy ways to get around them, and Sion being able to regenerate was the whole point of Sion.


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Old 05-05-2008, 02:23 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarter426
Voted for Nihilus, because the others aren't really annoying, since there are easy ways to get around them, and Sion being able to regenerate was the whole point of Sion.
That and Sion was also really easy to defeat. I'd put Nihulus and Sion being too easy as mine, if there was an option for it.
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Old 05-05-2008, 02:26 PM   #25
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Quote:
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That and Sion was also really easy to defeat. I'd put Nihulus and Sion being too easy as mine, if there was an option for it.
I agree, Kreia was the only one of the sith lords that was actually a challenge.
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Old 05-05-2008, 03:04 PM   #26
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Kreia took longer than Sion and Nihilus, but I didn't find that fight a challenge either. I'm comparing the fight to KotOR 1, which is perhaps unfair, but Malak was hard for me to beat. Sion, Nihilus, and Kreia were not hard, IMO, especially considering I've only had one play-through.
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Old 05-05-2008, 03:23 PM   #27
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Sion was my worst part. Not because I found him especially hard, but because he ruined verisimilitude. We are fighting with LIGHTSABERS. Sorry, but if I land a hit, he should be in half. His regeneration capabilities should not make any difference.
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Old 05-05-2008, 04:15 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corinthian
Sion was my worst part. Not because I found him especially hard, but because he ruined verisimilitude. We are fighting with LIGHTSABERS. Sorry, but if I land a hit, he should be in half. His regeneration capabilities should not make any difference.
well the same could be said for all enemies, since they all take more than 1 lightsaber hit to go down.
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Old 05-05-2008, 06:02 PM   #29
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The only problems I really think are Vrook being perhaps too heard if DS and Dantooine is your first planet and Nihilus being too weak. Personally I think the rest are your own pet peves.

Personally I like Sion; I think he has a unique and strange force power gift; which makes him hard to kill.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
I really was annoyed at the fact of Shem's super enhanced mod. It's damn impossible to live past the first two droids, unless you know how. But I found Vrook more annoying.
Why is Shem's mod in this thread? If you don't have the skill to survive level 1 with it installed, then maybe take the hint and don't have it installed.

How is there not enough Force Point regeneration? Even Yoda and Sidious get tired, infact, at least it seems to me all your requests tend to be for God items; if thats your thing fine, but don't moan about game mechanics especially TSL where your PC ends up well over powered in comparison to other enemies anyways.

Jedi Guardians AREN'T meant to have lots of FP, if you want FP go a different class, and quit moaning about people not making a pointless mod; if you want it, frankly do it yourself, the rest of us happily go Consular class if wanting more FP. You could always go Sentinal which is in the middle.



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Old 05-05-2008, 07:04 PM   #30
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Merged thread 'Hmm' with this one and edited poll choices. Paul, please keep threads about TSL in this forum and not Unknown regions. Thanks.


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Old 05-05-2008, 08:54 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
What are the most annoying things in TSL? -Please only pick 3 max Story not included-
How do you describe it as 'annoying'? You could consider it 'poorly written' (the erroneousness of that opinion notwithstanding), but I don't see what could make it irritating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
Not enough FP's for Jedi Guardians? Request not answered for a mod to sort this
The whole point of the Guardian class is to *not* have enough Force points, so as to offset how much better it is in melee than Sentinels and Consulars. If you wanted a god class, you should've had that as a poll option. (And you can simply cheat your Wis score to obscene levels, in any case.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
Shem's mod that kills people at LV 1? No offence Shem
Er, don't install it if you don't like it? :/

This seems more like an attempt to jab at various mods (and lack thereof) or parts of the gameplay you dislike rather than an actual poll, IMO.

On topic: I probably disliked the scaled gameplay more than anything else. As if the poor AI and overpowered items in the game weren't enough, all the enemies scale to your level and any potential for challenge is squashed. At least in KotOR I a first-level character could be slaughtered by Malak; in TSL the same character should be able to take on the various Sith Lords. (IIRC they don't have very many hit points by default. It's all simply added in accordance to whatever your PC's level is.)


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Old 05-05-2008, 10:00 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Rhodes
I really was annoyed at the fact of Shem's super enhanced mod. It's damn impossible to live past the first two droids, unless you know how.


Did you read Inyri's review about my mod?

Quote:
Originally Posted by What Inyri said in my review:
Let me start out by saying this mod is not for the faint of heart. If you're not an experienced player, and by experienced I mean you're insanely good at the game, you won't want to get this mod. Why? You'll die a miserable death, likely early on in the game.
This should be enough to tell you that you're not an advanced enough player to play my mod. I also mention in my readme file that my mod is for advanced players who need to be challenged.


Interested in hosting a your KOTOR or TSL mod at FileFront? Send your mod HERE and we'll validate it as soon as we can! FileFront is a good way to get publicity for your mod as we get 1000's of visitors everyday. Is my LucasForum PM box full again? If you really need to reach me, PM me at YouTube under the username: Shem L -- Watch my KOTOR videos! Download my mods from FileFront!

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Old 05-05-2008, 11:00 PM   #33
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Actually, Gurges, from what I remember, the only hits that are actually shown as landing during a lightsaber duel are ineffective ones, not ones with the blade, until you get a killing blow. With Sion, you land multiple 'Killing Blows' but because he's just in so much pain and he's got some dark side (Really, he would do well with 'Crawling in my skin' as his theme song) mojo, he's nigh on invincible.
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Old 05-05-2008, 11:23 PM   #34
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That's why you have to convince him to die.

And yes, I know it's a weird concept that not everyone likes, but that's Avellone at work.


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Old 05-05-2008, 11:48 PM   #35
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Yeah, I'm beginning to debate with myself whether Avellone either stopped using the drugs that allowed him to create Fallout 2, or was clean when making Fallout 2 and has started using something.
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Old 05-06-2008, 12:09 AM   #36
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Even Avellone can't be consistently brilliant.

If TSL is an example of Avellone at his worst, well, I'd take that over Bioware's story-writing at it's best. Not that Bioware's story for KotOR1 was particularly bad, mind you, it wasn't, but TSL's story was just so unexpectedly un-Star Wars-like, and quite deep as well.

Anywho, back OT: Nihilus being weak as a kitten was rather disappointing, but is also an easy fix with the right mod(s).

And Vrook being so hard to beat in such an unsatisfyingly easy game was not a disappoinment at all; it was rather refreshing.


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Last edited by Q; 05-06-2008 at 06:05 AM.
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Old 05-06-2008, 09:14 AM   #37
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Yeah I don't quite understand the TSL story-line bashing. I get that parts were left out, but shortcomings resulting from the crunched timeline were not a result of a poorly written story. I thought it was actually written really well.
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Old 05-06-2008, 04:29 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurges-Ahter
Yeah I don't quite understand the TSL story-line bashing. I get that parts were left out, but shortcomings resulting from the crunched timeline were not a result of a poorly written story. I thought it was actually written really well.
Yes - except for the parts where, even with the complete storyline, the gaps were explained 'by the Force'.


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Old 05-06-2008, 04:35 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ctrl_Alt_Del
Yes - except for the parts where, even with the complete storyline, the gaps were explained 'by the Force'.
I can understand the criticism there, but I still disagree when people state that the TSL story was poorly written, that it sucks, etc. It was still a great story, written well, but had some gaps that were caused by a compacted schedule, not by poor writing.
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Old 05-06-2008, 04:38 PM   #40
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I don't think it's a bad plot. But how much time would Mr. Avellone need to finish his megalomaniac project for the K2 story? Every writer must knows the limits of a book. I'd bet that, even if he had another year of development, we would still see those gaps out there, and he, just as he does now, would blame himself for it.


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