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Old 07-09-2008, 03:53 PM   #1
Darth krunchy
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Flurry vs. Power Attack vs. Critical Strike (or: Help me with my feats)

Which is most powerful and why?

I'm playing a high STR LS Scoundrel/Guardian (7/13) and won't have too many feats to mess with. I'd like to know where to spend these wisely.

So far, here's what I've got:

Scoundrel 1: Critical Strike I (free), (Insert one feat here)
Scoundrel 2: Two Weapon Fighting I
Scoundrel 5: Two Weapon Fighting II

After that, my next feat will be as a Guardian (Character level 8). Now, I really don't have too many to mess around with. I have 7 left after those listed above (8 total, since I don't know where to spend that level 1 feat). I know one of them is going to Two Weapon Fighting III. So, where do the last 7 feats go?

My main considerations are for the following:
Implants (3 feats)
Lightsabers (2 feats)
Critical Strike (2 feats)
Power Attack (3 feats)
Flurry (3 feats)
Conditioning (1, 2, or 3 feats... all are useful)

TIA

Last edited by Darth krunchy; 07-09-2008 at 04:43 PM.
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Old 07-09-2008, 10:15 PM   #2
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Power Attack just isn't worth it, so it's a toss up between Flurry and Critical Strike. If we were talking about K2, I'd say to just stick with the one you're given, but in K1 they aren't as balanced, so you might want to get both. Use Critical Strike if you're willing to sacrifice the defense penalty (it's 5 times that of Flurry's), and Flurry if you can take the attack penalty (adding a crystal or two should solve this).

All in all, I'd say go with Flurry. It's easier to compensate for its flaws, even though Critical Strike has the chance to do a lot more damage. Use Critical Strike sparingly. A good technique would be to stun the enemy and then use Critical Strike while they're still out.


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Old 07-09-2008, 11:10 PM   #3
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I know I'll get bashed for this one, but anyway - since you are a guardian, I would get power attack. Unfortunatly you have to get all three for it to be effective. Everybody says flurry is better and I have seen statistics that prove it, but in game power attack always does more damage than flurry. I actually added it up by reloading and fighting certain enemies again using just the other attack. In every case power attack has worked better for me. I don't know though... I would get flurry just to be safe... Its proven to be effective for just about everybody.

I would not go for the lightsabers feats, they are not bad feats, but others can give you more. Crystals can give you a good enough attack and damage modifier. All three inplants is very useful. Level three implants are very powerful and can make attribute points go way up. Conditioning...well you would only have one feat left (if you follow my advice) so just the first one I guess. Just my I'm sure others will disagree.


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Old 07-10-2008, 01:36 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Darth krunchy View Post
Which is most powerful and why?
You know, I have to say that I use Flurry a lot more than I do Critical Strike. I really like the extra attack in the round. Use that with Force Speed and I think that you have a pretty good attack going for ya. Or at least that is what I normally do... :/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth krunchy View Post
After that, my next feat will be as a Guardian (Character level 8). Now, I really don't have too many to mess around with. I have 7 left after those listed above (8 total, since I don't know where to spend that level 1 feat). I know one of them is going to Two Weapon Fighting III. So, where do the last 7 feats go?
Okay, I do have one thing to suggest. Again, this is something that I normally do, so take from it what you want. Okay, I try to hold off on leveling up throughout your play on Taris for several reasons. One of those reasons is that If you only level up to say 3 or four (I personally try to go with 2, to tell you the truth, but that can be just a little bit challenging). The reason that I do this is because if you level up to level 2 with scoundrel (or any other class ) and you become a Jedi, you have 18 Jedi level-ups! How sweet can that be. That is one way to get a considerably more feats. Especially if you become a Jedi Guardian. However, it definately depends on your skill level. It can be really hard to just stay at level 2 throughout Taris. Try 4. That would be a lot easier.
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Originally Posted by Darth krunchy View Post
My main considerations are for the following:
Implants (3 feats)
Lightsabers (2 feats)
Critical Strike (2 feats)
Power Attack (3 feats)
Flurry (3 feats)
Conditioning (1, 2, or 3 feats... all are useful)
With what you are considering, I would say
  • implants (If you become a scout, you get those for free) I would recommend this because you say that you are playing with High Strenght. The implant tree can/will be very helpful to you.
  • Flurry (only 2 if you become a soldier, I believe)
  • A Critical Strike
  • Instead of Conditioning, I use Toughness because you can get up to three extra vitality points each level up, as well as less damage dealt to you, I think. Or if you want both get level 1 or 2 toughness, and level 1 conditioning or vice veresa.

When you level up, you don't always have to get the full tree of that feat. I guess that it just depends on your preference is though.

I hope that I helped. Oh and welcome to the LucasForums Darth krunchy!

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Old 07-10-2008, 12:45 PM   #5
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Thanks for the advice and welcoms everybody!

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Originally Posted by HIGH ON PIE 14 View Post
Everybody says flurry is better and I have seen statistics that prove it, but in game power attack always does more damage than flurry.
I'd love to see those statistics, because I've read layouts that say Power Attack is the best, with Critical Strike close behind (and they say that Flurry stinks!).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev7 View Post
Okay, I try to hold off on leveling up throughout your play on Taris for several reasons. One of those reasons is that If you only level up to say 3 or four (I personally try to go with 2, to tell you the truth, but that can be just a little bit challenging). The reason that I do this is because if you level up to level 2 with scoundrel (or any other class ) and you become a Jedi, you have 18 Jedi level-ups! How sweet can that be. That is one way to get a considerably more feats. Especially if you become a Jedi Guardian. However, it definately depends on your skill level. It can be really hard to just stay at level 2 throughout Taris. Try 4. That would be a lot easier.
I've gone through Taris with a level 4 Scout, and it was challenging but do-able. The reason for 7 levels of Scoundrel with a Guardian was for the added Defense bonus and the Sneak Attack is AWESOME on Force Jumps. Since Guardians rely on the Force Powers the least out of any of the classes, I figured 7 levels of Scoundrel was alright.

Question: When you only do 2 levels on Taris, do you even dare take on Bendak? What's your secret to survival? Do you make Carth a melee character and stand in the rear?

Thanks.
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Old 07-10-2008, 02:55 PM   #6
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Bendak can be taken down with a level two character if you know what you are doing. You will need good amount of med packs (don't use advanced ones cause at level two, the regular ones should get you full health anyway) and also a few grenades. It's more costly to buy grenades so just try to save every one that you find of corpses and such. Just keep running and throwing grenades. If you do stun him with a stun grenade go up and whack him with a sword. Hit him a couple times and run cause if he wakes up, one hit from his sword and you are dead. Just my strategy... it usually works. Requires lot of grenades though, but since I never use them otherwise, it's all good.

I know I saw an actual table with all the power attack vs. flurry numbers out there, let me see if I can find it...

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Old 07-10-2008, 03:39 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HIGH ON PIE 14 View Post

I know I saw an actual table with all the power attack vs. flurry numbers out there, let me see if I can find it...

~HOP
Thanks, I'd really appreciate it.

Also, RE: Level squatting:

I've read of a bug that the characters in the apartment base won't gain XP if you do not level-up. Is this true, and if so, is it significant?

If it's true, I guess I'd try to keep the characters I intend on using a lot of with me as much as possible.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:01 PM   #8
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I favor flurry most because it's simply easier to assume you have a standard attack for every strike rather than the other attacks. Critical strike could increase the chance you can score big, but it could miss and you get nothing. Power strike could knock back your opponent in III, but it reduces the chance of a hit.

Flurry III simply represents up to five attacks in a single volley. With the exception of a critical hit now and again, you get the best number of times to attack your opponent. If I go up against Vrook in K2, I could determine how quickly I could kill him. Critical Strike MUST work, or you leave yourself vulnerable. Power strike only works if you hit the target and doesn't take advantage of force speed... at least I haven't had that. Power attack also reduced the chance to hit. Overall, I find Vrook easiest to beat with Flurry.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:20 PM   #9
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I have a feeling any analysis will depend heavily on BAB and/or the STR/DEX scores used.

For instance, I think if you had a character start with a 16 DEX (reasonably high) and boost it at every opportunity (+5 level-ups, +5 Implant, +3 Gloves, +2 Belt, +4 Stim, +3 Valour = 42 DEX) and were attacking with dual lightsabers and Master Speed, the +10 damage on each hit would be huge, and it'd be nearly impossible to actually land a hit on such a character. But I also believe that a character who's boosted STR at every chance (16 start, +5 Gauntles, +2 Belt, +3 LS Mastery +4 Stim, +3 Valour, +3 Heavy Exoskeleton = 36 STR) might benefit more from Flurry, since a 36 STR = +18 Damage on each hit.

The factor I can't put a number on is how many times you will actually hit an enemy. This is kinda the "X" factor in these equations, which is why I'm looking for somebody who's better at mathematics than I am.
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Old 07-10-2008, 04:55 PM   #10
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Bendak can be taken down with a level two character if you know what you are doing. You will need good amount of med packs (don't use advanced ones cause at level two, the regular ones should get you full health anyway) and also a few grenades. It's more costly to buy grenades so just try to save every one that you find of corpses and such. Just keep running and throwing grenades. If you do stun him with a stun grenade go up and whack him with a sword. Hit him a couple times and run cause if he wakes up, one hit from his sword and you are dead. Just my strategy... it usually works. Requires lot of grenades though, but since I never use them otherwise, it's all good.
Don't forget about the mines. Mines are very vital. As murph has said, do the 'mine dance'. It really isn't that hard to pull off though. As HOP said, you need to know what you are doing though. Oh, and make sure that you save your game before you actually battle Bendak Starkiller. Helps a lot if you die.

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Old 07-10-2008, 05:12 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Darth krunchy View Post
I have a feeling any analysis will depend heavily on BAB and/or the STR/DEX scores used.

For instance, I think if you had a character start with a 16 DEX (reasonably high) and boost it at every opportunity (+5 level-ups, +5 Implant, +3 Gloves, +2 Belt, +4 Stim, +3 Valour = 42 DEX) and were attacking with dual lightsabers and Master Speed, the +10 damage on each hit would be huge, and it'd be nearly impossible to actually land a hit on such a character.
Don't forget that your dexterity doesn't influence your chance to hit in KI. You would be hard to hit, but wouldn't deliver hits very easily either. Power attacks would reduce your chance to hit further. At least lightsaber finesse is available in K2, but not the first game.

I guess the reason for multiple types of strikes depends on what enemy you're facing. Malak's dexterity is outrageously high and wouldn't be stunned by a critical strike. Minor enemies would be the best use of power strike while difficult ones would be flurry.
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Old 07-10-2008, 07:01 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Darth_Yuthura View Post
Don't forget that your dexterity doesn't influence your chance to hit in KI.
It does with Lightsabers, even if it's not in the manual.
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Old 07-10-2008, 08:47 PM   #13
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Instead of Conditioning, I use Toughness because you can get up to three extra vitality points each level up, as well as less damage dealt to you, I think.
You can only get two points, if I recall correctly. The second tier is the reduced damage thingy. I've heard others say that toughness isn't worth it, but I give all three tiers to myself and every party member, and I've no complaints. 3 feats is a small sacrifice for 40 extra VP in K1 and 60+ in K2.

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It does with Lightsabers, even if it's not in the manual.
Yeah, but it doesn't affect the damage, so it's probably better to focus on strength and find other ways to defend yourself. In K1 I usually wear (fully upgraded) Environmental Bastion Armor for most of the Star Forge. Not only does it have a ridiculously high defense bonus, but it also makes you immune to most grenades.


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Old 07-10-2008, 11:40 PM   #14
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I liked the Environmental Bastion Armor best for asthetics and function as well. It's the coolest armor of any game... Bandon's comes close, but doesn't have the technological edge to it.

Anyway, I only favor conditioning level 2 for the reduced damage. The total HP really don't matter to me as long as I have medpacks and healing.
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Old 07-10-2008, 11:51 PM   #15
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I always thought flurry was the best. but now i look at it, power attack and critical hit are really good too. it depends really.
if your character isnt good at handling a blade, the flurry usually came out as unsuccesful.
i'd say power attack was most useful.


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Old 07-11-2008, 01:46 AM   #16
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You can only get two points, if I recall correctly. The second tier is the reduced damage thingy. I've heard others say that toughness isn't worth it, but I give all three tiers to myself and every party member, and I've no complaints. 3 feats is a small sacrifice for 40 extra VP in K1 and 60+ in K2.
Hmmm, maybe that was in TSL? I will have to check.

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Yeah, but it doesn't affect the damage, so it's probably better to focus on strength and find other ways to defend yourself. In K1 I usually wear (fully upgraded) Environmental Bastion Armor for most of the Star Forge. Not only does it have a ridiculously high defense bonus, but it also makes you immune to most grenades.
Is the Environmental Bastion Armor the LS Star Forge Robes? I don't ever recall seeing anything by that name. I have and play the regular Xbox version of both of the games, unfortunetly.

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Old 07-11-2008, 02:20 AM   #17
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I think Suvam sells it. If not him, then the premium merchant on Korriban.

I myself have never used it, because I think it restricts the use of force powers. I could be wrong, though.

OT: For KotOR: Flurry.
For TSL: Power Attack.


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Old 07-11-2008, 06:17 AM   #18
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I prefer Flurry Attack because you have the biggest chances to make a high dmg on 1 combat round...
I like the stun efect a Critical, which can be very important...
So for me it's:
1)Flurry
2)Critical
3)Power
And that's for tsl and k1...


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Old 07-11-2008, 06:51 AM   #19
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Hmmm, maybe that was in TSL? I will have to check.
Nah, if anything it's in K2 and not 1 (seeing as I haven't played 1 in well over a year...or two). I'll check, though...

Quote:
Master Toughness

Prerequisites:
Level 8

The character is further fortified against damage. The character gains an additional +1 vitality point at each level up, retroactive for levels previously gained. This is in addition to the +1 vitality point per level granted by Toughness, and the 2-point physical damage resistance granted by Improved Toughness.
Yup, just two. And I didn't even realize the second tier was that valuable. Oh wait, just physical. Well, more than 40 extra VP is still worth it.

Quote:
Is the Environmental Bastion Armor the LS Star Forge Robes? I don't ever recall seeing anything by that name. I have and play the regular Xbox version of both of the games, unfortunetly.
Yup, unfortunately for you, it's a unique item that can only be purchased on Yavin Station. It also happens to be ridiculously awesome.

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So for me it's:
1)Flurry
2)Critical
3)Power
And that's for tsl and k1...
Eh...I'd say CS/SS is worth more than F/RS in K2 simply because of the upgrade system. If you find the right weapon, you can get the critical threat range to a ridiculously high level. Mandalorian rippers can actually have a 120% chance of landing a critical hit.

(ok, so it stops at 75%...whatever)


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Old 07-11-2008, 08:56 AM   #20
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Don't forget about the mines. Mines are very vital. As murph has said, do the 'mine dance'. It really isn't that hard to pull off though. As HOP said, you need to know what you are doing though. Oh, and make sure that you save your game before you actually battle Bendak Starkiller. Helps a lot if you die.
How do you use mines against Bendak? I thought he doesn't chase you. I thought he just uses his blaster if you run away from him.
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Old 07-11-2008, 09:07 AM   #21
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I believe the idea is to place mines right in front of him, and then run far enough away so that he has to take one or two steps towards you in order to get into firing range. Though I could be wrong. I never use mines myself; I just sell them. I generally find it easier just to shoot or stab everyone.


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Old 07-11-2008, 09:22 AM   #22
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Well i got bored of the lack of variation, so i just click on the enemy to attack and watch him die through successive 'default' attacks.
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Old 07-11-2008, 09:24 AM   #23
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Well i got bored of the lack of variation, so i just click on the enemy to attack and watch him die through successive 'default' attacks.
Not so easy with a 2nd level character though.


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Old 07-11-2008, 09:28 AM   #24
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I always preferred flurry because it looked like it was more powerful, regardless of whether it actually is or not.


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Old 07-19-2008, 07:01 PM   #25
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Yup, unfortunately for you, it's a unique item that can only be purchased on Yavin Station. It also happens to be ridiculously awesome.
Darn. That stinks. :/

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Old 07-23-2008, 10:54 PM   #26
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I'd opt for flurry most because it offers the greatest number of times you can hit in a round. This simply allows for the law of probability to take its advantage. I find that you can miss twice with power attack and then get both, but flurry offers the greatest consistency.
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Old 01-04-2014, 09:45 AM   #27
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With a high STR (I start with 15, plus 5 from level-ups, 3 from LS Mastery, 7 from equipment), I find I stun quite a few enemies. So if I don't kill them in one round, they're definitely dead in two.

Maximizing critical strike only increases this.

Here's where I spent my feats:

Crit strike x3
Implants x3
Toughness x2
Two weapon fighting x3

Nasty build. I've been told a level 5/15 soldier/guardian will out-damage this build, so I'm going to try that next. My biggest hangup is getting past the ridiculous power attack animation.


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