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Old 10-26-2008, 02:22 AM   #1
Fiestainabox
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Kotor MMO Info

(Sorry if you guys already found this)

Wookiepedia updated they're news section with brand new info for the new Kotor MMO! Really, it was just a link to gamespot, but whatever works.

Linkage

From what I read, you'll be able to play as either the Republic, or the Sith, and you can be a jedi/sith with force powers early in the game.

Even cooler though, is this part of the article:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamespot
KOTOR 3 MIA...WTF?
While the cash-minting potential of The Old Republic has executives salivating, many BioWare fans were disappointed the series didn't return to its single-player RPG roots. "There are a lot of reasons why we decided not to do KOTOR 3, and why we decided to do this as an MMO instead," said Nichols. "The unique aspect of storytelling, which is really differentiated for this game, is something the KOTOR franchise did very well, and we felt that just doing a single-player experience with a new KOTOR really misses the opportunity to take this out to a much wider audience."

"One of the things we like to joke about is just the sheer amount of content we're doing," Ohlen mused. "Our fans ask, 'Why aren't you doing Knights of the Old Republic 3?' What we're really doing is Knights of the Old Republic 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, and 12-plus. We have that much content and that many stories...We really get to do a lot of things we really wouldn't get to do in [a] KOTOR 3."

That much content? From Bioware? Hmm, this has been said a lot before...but it looks like we have a REAL competitor to World of Warcraft.

But, then again, what is content defined as? The 2.4 patch for WoW included a wealth of new content, but really, it was just a whole lot of daily quests you do everyday, a regular instance, and a DAMN hard raid.


With all this so called content, they're setting the bar REALLY high for themselves, are they making the next WoW? Or are they making the next "Age of Conan"


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Old 10-26-2008, 02:54 AM   #2
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Just so you know, there's a brand new section of Lucasforums dedicated to "The Old Republic" MMO here: http://www.lucasforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=730


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Old 10-26-2008, 02:54 AM   #3
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Well with 9 million subscribers in wow they've got the resources avalible to hire a gigantic staff to work on the game.


And yes, sunwell was added in 2.4 or whatever it was but the instance before that was black temple. And having been through both those instances myself I gotta say that sunwell wasn't even half the instance that the black temple was.. not story wise, looks or the level of "fun"


I am still holding out to see how they're going to add a good story, but I believe that if anyone can do it, then it will be bioware.
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Old 10-26-2008, 09:14 AM   #4
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It's funny how they act as though making it an MMO was how they could make the game more than just KOTOR 3; but 3,4,5,6 etc. A HUGE game could have still been a single player one. They made it an MMO for the $$$ that the kind of game rakes in.
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Old 10-26-2008, 11:45 AM   #5
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I agree Henz, they are only making an mmo for the subscription fees people will pay.
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Old 10-26-2008, 12:47 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Henz View Post
It's funny how they act as though making it an MMO was how they could make the game more than just KOTOR 3; but 3,4,5,6 etc. A HUGE game could have still been a single player one. They made it an MMO for the $$$ that the kind of game rakes in.
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I agree Henz, they are only making an mmo for the subscription fees people will pay.
Prejudice ahoy!

Ever heard of Guild Wars?
No subscription fees, because of game system (semi mmo) low server costs. Sold 2 million game units of the ORIGINAL game alone ($50 dollars times 2 million). And there are THREE expansions and some little micro-transitions for t-shirts and such.

Plus, I don't see why it is BAD you have to pay for it? There are MILLIONS of players. You get FREE new content (WoW content is perfect. Every patch gives new quests and new stuff) and have the capability of playing online in a huge world.
And, with all the respect, if you have a job, you can afford it. I should know. I have a 9rather) lousy job atm and party every weekend. Can easily make it though.

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Old 10-26-2008, 01:23 PM   #7
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"The unique aspect of storytelling, which is really differentiated for this game, is something the KOTOR franchise did very well, and we felt that just doing a single-player experience with a new KOTOR really misses the opportunity to take this out to a much wider audience."
Got it, Bioware.

Don't know what to say. It remains to be seen whether storytelling has a place in MMORPGs.
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Old 10-26-2008, 03:51 PM   #8
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(WoW content is perfect. Every patch nerfs the game in some new and horrid way)
fixed. Hey I enjoy wow, but I don't find it's content to be worth paying 40 for the game(the WoW+BC set) and then 15 a month.


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Old 10-26-2008, 05:25 PM   #9
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I think it is cool you get to be a jedi from the start but should there be other options like
smuggler,bounty hunter e.c.t?


I was also wonderin if there are any screenshots realseased yet


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Old 10-26-2008, 06:42 PM   #10
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I hate the "larger audience" obsession. It's all about the cash.

Just look at Nintendo. They're trying to appeal to old people and it's making the real gamers hate the Wii.


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Old 10-26-2008, 08:09 PM   #11
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That's because anyone who considers themself a 'Real Gamer' is an arrogant twit. The Wii is a perfectly respectable gaming platform.

As for it being 'all about the cash' WELL, OF COURSE IT'S ALL ABOUT THE CASH. THEY'RE A CORPORATION.
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Old 10-27-2008, 12:10 AM   #12
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By "real" I think was meant "hardcore" since the Wii, although respectable and innovative, attracts mostly "casual" gamers and families. The "hardcore" gamers don't hate the Wii, they don't see any reason for themselves to buy the system BECAUSE MOST(not all) games are NOT for gamers like them. I myself don't mind a nice, casual game every now and then, though I wouldn't buy the system still...or at least not for myself.

The all about the cash part is mostly true. When it comes down to it in the end, the company wants profit, but any good company knows that if they want to see the profit they'll have to put their heart and soul into their work. So for Bioware who's known famously for their hard work in their story-driven RPG's to make an MMO is a big leap and could either make or break them. We'll find out at it's release then won't we?


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Old 10-27-2008, 08:42 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiestainabox View Post
That much content? From Bioware? Hmm, this has been said a lot before...
They've made huge games before (Baldur's Gate II took around 200 - 250 hours to play through if not skipping things) so they should have some experience with it. Though lately the trend seems to have been going in the opposite direction, with games being shorter and shorter instead.

It's also worth keeping in mind that they're probably still at the "designer's vision" stage at the moment, and a chunk of that may end up being cut out (or moved to later expansion packs instead) due to time constraints during development. Looks like most games tend to get trimmed down to some degree prior to release.

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Old 10-27-2008, 09:54 AM   #14
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I hate the "larger audience" obsession. It's all about the cash.
Well they are a business after all, not a charity.

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Old 10-27-2008, 10:23 AM   #15
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Well they are a business after all, not a charity.
In this case they might end up not making nearly as much money though, because a lot of people myself included don't like MMOs especially when they don't finish the KotOR trilogy.
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Old 10-27-2008, 07:28 PM   #16
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I'm obviously not disappointed that Bioware made a decision because of greater profit, just that said decision simultaneously buried KOTOR III in the process, especially as it didn't really need to.
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Old 10-28-2008, 11:59 AM   #17
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You guys also gotta look at it this way, with the money blizzard made off of WoW, they're funding starcraft and diablo, along with another rumored MMO. Think of how many more RPG's bioware could make if TOR is popular. More RPGS = More Win.



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Originally Posted by Web Rider View Post
fixed. Hey I enjoy wow, but I don't find it's content to be worth paying 40 for the game(the WoW+BC set) and then 15 a month.
Depends on what you do. Grinding for weeks on end isn't worth it for me, meet up with a friend and make an area team, or join a raiding guild, its only a waste if you don't do anything each month.

You can also get the base for $20 Canadian now, and the BC is also around that price, Wraiths a bit more, mosty because its newer.

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Got it, Bioware.

Don't know what to say. It remains to be seen whether storytelling has a place in MMORPGs.
There are storylines in mmo's, if you really want a storyline, fine a good RP server. Biowares decent at making storylines, this one should be excellent.

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Prejudice ahoy!

Ever heard of Guild Wars?
No subscription fees, because of game system (semi mmo) low server costs. Sold 2 million game units of the ORIGINAL game alone ($50 dollars times 2 million). And there are THREE expansions and some little micro-transitions for t-shirts and such.

Plus, I don't see why it is BAD you have to pay for it? There are MILLIONS of players. You get FREE new content (WoW content is perfect. Every patch gives new quests and new stuff) and have the capability of playing online in a huge world.
And, with all the respect, if you have a job, you can afford it. I should know. I have a 9rather) lousy job atm and party every weekend. Can easily make it though.
QFT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz View Post
It's funny how they act as though making it an MMO was how they could make the game more than just KOTOR 3; but 3,4,5,6 etc. A HUGE game could have still been a single player one. They made it an MMO for the $$$ that the kind of game rakes in.
It's true, MMO's Make money. Is there something morally wrong about that? Everytime a company makes a MMO, everyone starts screaming SELL OUT, and totally Poo Poo's the game before its even out. Just because MMO's make money dosen't mean the designers are corrupt and really don't care about the players.

A HUGE singleplayer game is quite boring after the 200 hours you spend on it. Do what I did and beat all of oblivions storylines on xbox. I got all the achievements for Shivering Isles. After I did. I asked "Now what?" then quietly put the game back in its case, then moved on. However, I've spent 5 times as much time play WoW, and I'm not even slightly close to being done with the game, thanks to the new updates, I rarely ask "Now what?."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henz View Post
I'm obviously not disappointed that Bioware made a decision because of greater profit, just that said decision simultaneously buried KOTOR III in the process, especially as it didn't really need to.
Think of it this way, would you rather play the same game for 6 years like people have done with kotor 1 and 2, or play 1 game that changes quite a bit over 6 years? The decision is obvious for me.


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Last edited by Fiestainabox; 10-28-2008 at 12:21 PM. Reason: Error: Mismatched Quotes.
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Old 10-28-2008, 03:12 PM   #18
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Think of it this way, would you rather play the same game for 6 years like people have done with kotor 1 and 2, or play 1 game that changes quite a bit over 6 years? The decision is obvious for me.

It's obvious to me too. I don't want to play any game for 6 years, so I'd pick the one that I wanted that would last me a couple of weeks over the one I didn't that'd go on for 6 years
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Old 10-28-2008, 05:28 PM   #19
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So I guess Star Wars: The Old Republic, a story taking place 300 years after KOTOR is the answer to the "True Sith"?


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Old 10-28-2008, 05:35 PM   #20
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So I guess Star Wars: The Old Republic, a story taking place 300 years after KOTOR is the answer to the "True Sith"?
Sorry to say...but READ before you post. The Sith in this game ARE the True Sith. The only explanation we still need to get is what took them 300+ years to conquer the galaxy and what Revan and the Exile's part was in this. But it's the successor to Kotor in every single way. Jedi order is restored by Atton etc and the Republic is back because of Carth and his crew.

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Old 10-30-2008, 08:29 PM   #21
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Sorry to say...but READ before you post. The Sith in this game ARE the True Sith. The only explanation we still need to get is what took them 300+ years to conquer the galaxy and what Revan and the Exile's part was in this. But it's the successor to Kotor in every single way. Jedi order is restored by Atton etc and the Republic is back because of Carth and his crew.
I don't see the hype with MMOs, I'm happy with just playing an 8-bit nintendo RPG.


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Old 10-30-2008, 09:09 PM   #22
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If KotOR 3-12 is tedious grinding with supposed story, then I don't want to be a part of it. Honestly, the only reason I'm giving TOR a chance is because it's Bioware. Any other company and I probably wouldn't bother. As for beating out WoW, I really don't think that's important. Or impossible, for that matter. I think a majority of people will toss away the idea of TOR at first, just because it's a part of the Star Wars franchise. Maybe if the game becomes ridiculously popular in SW skeptics and is really successful, there could be a large amount of players. But honestly? I doubt it'll happen. Not that I don't want it to, I just doubt. Bioware is setting the standard too high, which is setting us up for disappointment. They're promising an MMO, which are notoriously known for being storyless grind fests, with Single Player features, and I just don't think it'll work.

Again, don't get me wrong: I really want TOR to work out and successful. But for now, the basis of the game seems really far-fetched and a potential bust. I suppose only time will tell.




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Old 10-30-2008, 10:45 PM   #23
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Yeah it pretty much will tell. Like I said making an MMO is something that'll make or break you and if it doesn't have the right company or the right team with the right mindset and so on, the game will ultimately fail.

In this case think of PS3; the Sony company set the standard far too high by promising so much in the console and then disappoint thousands upon millions with it's high price rate. Not only that, they once again shipped far too little consoles over to the U.S. causing a very quick shortage. Although they had the $600 price, they seemed to sell out and also cause controversy with a person being shot while standing in line on release day.

During the console's first year out it was in 3rd place with the 360 in second and the Wii in first, but since then with the release of several exclusive PS3 games the sales rose. It then rose higher with the price drops that took place after the president resigned(you know why).

Anyway I digress from my main point which is that TOR is promising so much but Bioware is disappointing millions of Star Wars fans with it's high price.


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Old 10-30-2008, 11:03 PM   #24
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Anyway I digress from my main point which is that TOR is promising so much but Bioware is disappointing millions of Star Wars fans with it's high price.
I'm going to go ahead and quote a few posts from someone who has replied to this better than I.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat
Haha if you count in the 4 large sodas at movie theater prices and the popcorn for the kids(and usually a shared one for the adults) the cost of a movie out is more expensive than a month of gaming at an online MMO.

Tickets around $30(if the kids are young enough....)
Drinks/Treats/headache medicine(might not be your kids, but other kids)/therapy bill.... Definately more than $30

So the monthly comes out cheaper for an online game than one night at the movies... at worst 2 nights at the movies.
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Originally Posted by Tommycat
Strangely enough, I understand where the aversion to paying a monthly fee comes from. I mean you don't pay for cable TV on a monthly basis, because the regular TV stations are enjoyable. I mean why would you pay for something on a monthly basis. Why would people pay a monthly fee for satellite radio?

sorry, I just find that argument very old and annoying. Many people already pay monthly fees to get entertainment. Generally far greater fees than 10 to 15 a month. How much do people pay for internet? While the internet is useful, most people use it for entertainment. Before MMO's I spent more time at bars. 40-50 minimum a night at a bar. Why do we pay for video rental instead of buying the DVD? How much do you spend a month on entertainment altogether?
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All the people freaking out about montly fees, wtf? You expect the server maintenance to be free? When I was playing WoW, paying a montly fee SAVED me money. I used to buy three or four games a month at least to cure my boredom, but paying for and playing only one game stopped me from doing that. I'd say it saved me at least 100 a month. Seriously, monthly fees aren't the devil you are making them out to be, and to expect to play an mmo without there being one is just ridiculous.
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Old 10-31-2008, 06:12 AM   #25
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This is really a fairly obvious approach - Fans were going to whine and whine hard no matter what they did, because no matter what they did, a significant portion of the fanbase would be displeased by what was done or not done with the Exile, Revan, the True Sith, the two crews of the Hawk, and so on. Let's face it, we've metamorphosed into the classic Unpleasable Fanbase.

So, what do you do when you're going to have a lot of people unhappy no matter what you do? Say 'screw them' and appeal to a new demographic. This draws in the old Galaxies players, the people dissatisfied with WoW, anyone wanting a decent Sci-Fi (Star Wars appeals to Sci-Fi even if it's only loosely related to the genre) MMO, as well as the less whiny aspects of the KotoR fanbase, Bioware's standby players, and a lot of other people.
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Old 10-31-2008, 07:47 AM   #26
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Monthly fees really aren't the issue here for me. I'm mostly just hesitant because of the huge bar that Bioware has set.




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Old 10-31-2008, 09:33 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GarfieldJL View Post
In this case they might end up not making nearly as much money though, because a lot of people myself included don't like MMOs especially when they don't finish the KotOR trilogy.
I think it is safe to say that a MMO has much more revenue potential than a single PC game.

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Old 10-31-2008, 09:37 AM   #28
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I'm more interested in the story, but I don't like where the MMO has taken KOTOR III. I think that Lucasarts has set The Old Republic 300 years after TSL in order to have it brush the KOTOR storyline just enough.

If the MMO is a success, they will declare TOR as KOTOR III and keep going from there. If TOR is not such a great success, Lucasarts could say that TOR was not associated with KOTOR at all. Despite the bad rep that came from TSL being incomplete, KOTOR has a rich fan base. If there is to be a KOTOR III, then it would depend on the MMO being a failure.

(Of course, this is just my opinion and is not backed by any facts or sources. Feel free to dismiss this)
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Old 10-31-2008, 01:32 PM   #29
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I think it is safe to say that a MMO has much more revenue potential than a single PC game.
I hate to admit it, but it does have more potential. But, like i've said many times, they need to do something that hasn't been done before. And I don't think that LA is smart enough to realize this.
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Old 10-31-2008, 04:29 PM   #30
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LucasArts is smart enough to know you have to do something special to break WoW's stranglehold on the MMO market.
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Old 10-31-2008, 05:28 PM   #31
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Yep, and TOR has the potential to do just that.

That is, if it doesn't suck.


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Old 10-31-2008, 10:10 PM   #32
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I hate to admit it, but it does have more potential. But, like i've said many times, they need to do something that hasn't been done before. And I don't think that LA is smart enough to realize this.
There was an article I saw today that emphasized that sequels were the most significant reason that EA games had such a significant loss in their profits after such a great run the last three years or so... they made original games and continued with sequels.

I think that KOTOR III would have raked in more profit if it had been done shortly after the second was released due to the cliffhanger, but they tried something that could not quite be identified as 'original,' but not enough to qualify as 'conclusion.' I think LA does realize this, but don't have any good ideas lined up that could be put into action at the present time.
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Old 10-31-2008, 10:43 PM   #33
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Sequels can become a death sentence to any one series whether it be a game, a movie or any other form of entertainment. Take the Mortal Kombat movies: the first one was decent and made quite a bit of profit; it's sequel on the other hand sucked and killed it. Now knowing that the next sequel is in production it could just add to the pile or repair the damage. The DMC series also had its praise with the first game and then sucked with the second. Fortunately it came back with two more, much better sequels.

KotOR III may have made some good cash if released shortly after, but the way I see it is that if they decided, "yes we're doing KIII" rather than the MMO and yet did NOT release it shortly after and spent that time innovating and improving it's look and feel all the while keeping the initial KotOR feel, finally to release it fall of next year...the game would most likely become rpg game of the year pulling in three to four times as much as they would releasing earlier. Same goes for KII; they should have worked to expand the deadline beforehand to improve the game.


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Old 10-31-2008, 10:49 PM   #34
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They shouldn't have made it at all. KotoR II should not have tried to connect itself to KotoR I's plotline. It wasn't necessary, in fact, it was extremely stupid. KotoR was not written to have a direct sequel.
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Old 10-31-2008, 10:51 PM   #35
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No it wasn't, but due to it's high popularity and the want for more drove them to it and that's how it pretty much unraveled from there.


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Old 10-31-2008, 10:52 PM   #36
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Yeah, you'd think they'd figure out that doesn't work after a while.
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Old 11-01-2008, 11:38 AM   #37
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Quote:
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No it wasn't, but due to it's high popularity and the want for more drove them to it and that's how it pretty much unraveled from there.
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Yeah, you'd think they'd figure out that doesn't work after a while.
Thus setting the MMO 300 years afterwards makes all the more sense.

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Old 11-01-2008, 03:03 PM   #38
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Although K2 wasn't exactly necessary, especially as a direct sequal, but I wouldn't say that it was a bad choice or even that the game is bad. I like it, as do a lot of other people. The easter eggs appearances from past characters help to add that nostalgic feeling to the game, which did something to make up for the fact that the game is incomplete.




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Old 12-07-2008, 03:40 PM   #39
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Doing KOTOR 3,4,5,6,7,8,9..........Whatever. Idiots. I don't want "tons of content" I want a decent amount that finishes up the Revan/Exile storyline. Every fan I know has been saying "please don't make this an MMO" yet they did anyway. I still can't believe this garbage.
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Old 12-08-2008, 12:03 AM   #40
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Every fan I know has been saying "please don't make this an MMO" yet they did anyway. I still can't believe this garbage.
I would like to see the MMO made. Big companies that like money would too.


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