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Old 08-08-2009, 10:11 PM   #1
jonathan7
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J7's random tinkerings thread... (56k beware!)

Bonjourno All!

Force Fashion 2 for TSL is coming a long nicely; unfortunately my top secret partner in crime has had to step down, but fortunately I have a new top secret partner in crime

Anyways I have started work on Force Fashion for K1...

Here is the first test robe, which I have been working on...

Show spoiler


I shall keep you updated as things go....

As ever thoughts, suggestions, criticisms etc are welcome



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Last edited by jonathan7; 09-23-2010 at 05:32 AM.
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Old 08-08-2009, 10:46 PM   #2
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Woah... already can't wait for this...


Does anyone actually read these?
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Old 08-08-2009, 11:06 PM   #3
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The skin itself looks great, but it kind of looks weird overlapping the model. I think you should add a little more definition on the edges of the outside part of the robe... if that means anything. Look in the smaller picture at the top if you don't know what I'm talking about.

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Old 08-08-2009, 11:32 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gob View Post
The skin itself looks great, but it kind of looks weird overlapping the model.
Yeah, I like the model, but it has its limitations unfortunately, I'm just a skinner and not a modeller so can't fix that issue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gob View Post
I think you should add a little more definition on the edges of the outside part of the robe... if that means anything. Look in the smaller picture at the top if you don't know what I'm talking about.
Yeah, I know what you mean - it was an issue I sorted out with the larger pictures



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Old 08-09-2009, 12:22 AM   #5
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Honestly, I think it looks really weird. I can't explain it... it just looks too... neat.

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Old 08-09-2009, 12:49 AM   #6
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Honestly, I think it looks really weird. I can't explain it... it just looks too... neat.
Isn't that what a Jedi is? The Jedi is the clean and tidy guy, and the Sith is the Jedi's messy roommate.
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Old 08-09-2009, 01:21 AM   #7
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Isn't that what a Jedi is? The Jedi is the clean and tidy guy, and the Sith is the Jedi's messy roommate.
Ha.. good analogy. Jedi usually have baggyish clothing though. Maybe it's the lack of cloth folds that's throwing me off.

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Old 08-09-2009, 01:47 AM   #8
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Hmm, nice pose there in the middle. He looks like he's waiting to get kissed.

Anyway, the texture itself looks great, but I don't know if it fits on that robe model, which is pretty flawed (the shadows and edges are seen in all the wrong places). Someone with more modeling experience ought to fix it.

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Old 08-09-2009, 02:20 AM   #9
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I don't know why but that robe looks... wrong somehow.


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Old 08-09-2009, 03:31 AM   #10
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Hopefully I explain it right.

Suggestion:



1 (Red). See the robe overlap?

2 (Blue). Invert it to the other side. The arrow points to the mark in the model of the robe overlap on the other side because of how the original base skin was built around.


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Old 08-09-2009, 06:03 AM   #11
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The overlap is also built into the model, Shem.




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Old 08-09-2009, 10:43 AM   #12
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The overlap is also built into the model, Shem.
Yeah, that's what he's saying. He's saying to make use of the overlap on the model by making the robe overlap align with it, I think.

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Old 08-09-2009, 02:56 PM   #13
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Yeah, that's what he's saying. He's saying to make use of the overlap on the model by making the robe overlap align with it, I think.
Bingo!


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Old 08-09-2009, 03:09 PM   #14
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Aye, I knew what Shem meant

What other model suggestions are there, I'd like something that has tabards - Jolee's is a possibility for male characters, but I'd need the female variety tweaked by a modeller if anyone is up for it...



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Old 06-26-2010, 11:33 PM   #15
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Reboot... Revan Reskin...

Well having asked a few people for suggestions, I will now open this up for you all to see. Having come across this the other day I felt inspired to do a reskin of Revans robes... Here are the results this far;



Up close; (56k beware)

Show spoiler


You can also see its evolution thanks to various improvements suggested by Astor, Inyri, DI and mimartin...

WIP Photo Album

Thoughts/Suggestions/Criticisms/Improvements welcome!



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Old 06-27-2010, 10:06 PM   #16
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I'd recommend making the cloth texture on the revan robe have smaller and more 'squares'(make the texture smaller :P) and to lower the opacity it seems too 'visable' making it a bit distracting and unrealistic normally you wouldn't really notice a texture on clothing unless you really looked.


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Old 06-27-2010, 10:18 PM   #17
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^I agree, and I also think that you might want to make the hood, robe, and cape have different consistencies if you know what I mean, so that they each look a bit different instead of the uniform cloth texture. Also maybe some very subtle, desaturated reds in the armor part as well. But besides that it's a big improvement over the original.

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Old 06-28-2010, 02:45 AM   #18
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I'm not sure if I'm missing something but from the before and after picture it appears as though you stripped away all the detail. It looks like you softened everything. Now up close I can see you've changed some things but from the, what appears to be, gameplay distance it really looks, to me anyway, as though you smoothed out all the definition.


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Old 06-29-2010, 10:58 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The-Seraphim View Post
I'd recommend making the cloth texture on the revan robe have smaller and more 'squares'(make the texture smaller :P) and to lower the opacity it seems too 'visable' making it a bit distracting and unrealistic normally you wouldn't really notice a texture on clothing unless you really looked.
Show spoiler


Better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dak Drexl View Post
^I agree, and I also think that you might want to make the hood, robe, and cape have different consistencies if you know what I mean, so that they each look a bit different instead of the uniform cloth texture. Also maybe some very subtle, desaturated reds in the armor part as well. But besides that it's a big improvement over the original.
With regards armour colour, I'm gonna produce various colour options once I've finally finished reskining the other aspects...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Druganator View Post
I'm not sure if I'm missing something but from the before and after picture it appears as though you stripped away all the detail. It looks like you softened everything. Now up close I can see you've changed some things but from the, what appears to be, gameplay distance it really looks, to me anyway, as though you smoothed out all the definition.
Did you click on the "show spoiler button?

Hint click on show spoiler below (and above)...

Show spoiler


For the record, I've doubled the size of the texture map, and completely reskinned everything, I don't "smooth" out definition... This is me we're talking about, I don't generally manipulate in game textures in any way... The only things which remain from the original texture is the folds in the cape and fabric...



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Old 06-29-2010, 11:23 PM   #20
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I clicked on the spoiler before and I couldn't tell, but the other one shows what you're talking about. you took the shiny rigid things that appeared, to me anyway, as detailed and made them into detailed fabric that doesn't shine or stand out in the same way.


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Old 06-30-2010, 11:26 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by jonathan7 View Post
Show spoiler


Better?
Yes that looks a lot better, could a perhaps see a normal game view for the front and back? (normal distance)


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Old 07-04-2010, 11:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Druganator View Post
I clicked on the spoiler before and I couldn't tell, but the other one shows what you're talking about. you took the shiny rigid things that appeared, to me anyway, as detailed and made them into detailed fabric that doesn't shine or stand out in the same way.
I'm not quite sure I follow, but I've tried to emphasize the shadows on the armour more to "show" the detail and added a couple more ridges...

Quote:
Originally Posted by The-Seraphim View Post
Yes that looks a lot better, could a perhaps see a normal game view for the front and back? (normal distance)
Here is the current version (I forgot to brighten my screenshots, so apologises if they're a bit dark)...



Here is a current close up...

Show spoiler


Here is a variant which includes the alpha channels...



As usual let me know thoughts/criticisms/suggestions.



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Old 07-04-2010, 11:59 PM   #23
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Hey j7, I didn't realize you added this to a thread. I'll put further comments here instead of PMs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Druganator View Post
I'm not sure if I'm missing something but from the before and after picture it appears as though you stripped away all the detail. It looks like you softened everything. Now up close I can see you've changed some things but from the, what appears to be, gameplay distance it really looks, to me anyway, as though you smoothed out all the definition.
yeah, I noticed that too, and mentioned in a PM:
Quote:
It looks like you're going for a textured leather armour (like snakeskin). It works well in that little oval area, but the rest looks blurry. The lack of shadows & highlights along the seams kinda takes away from the sculpted\segmented look, but maybe that's intentional.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan7 View Post
Here is the current version (I forgot to brighten my screenshots, so apologises if they're a bit dark)...
The darker shot works better, since it emphasizes the contrast in the cape and hood. Now the shadows don't look washed out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonathan7 View Post
Here is a variant which includes the alpha channels...
The alpha channels make a big difference. Now, those ridges we were talking about earlier, actually stand out and look dimensional, rather than flat or blurry.

One major thing that just jumped out at me, is that the loin cloth (BTW better now that it is red like the mask) passes through the gold ring, and then folds out to the sides, but you've still got those side cloths coloured black. Perhaps you want them to be red on one side, and black on the other? If so, you might want to put hints of the other colour on each part, so that it looks like part of the back side can be seen along the edge. For example, have the bottom edge of the black fold over and show a bit of red. Hmm , I might not be making this any clearer.

Or, maybe you'll want to make the side cloth red to match the loin cloth? Either way, pay special attention to the middle part of the mirrored loin cloth, as there should be some space there, since the loin cloth is technically two pieces of cloth hanging side by side.



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Old 07-05-2010, 07:57 AM   #24
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Also, the red line on the middle of the mask seems weird, you should make it as the other red parts.


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Old 07-05-2010, 12:40 PM   #25
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Quote:
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The alpha channels make a big difference. Now, those ridges we were talking about earlier, actually stand out and look dimensional, rather than flat or blurry.
Totally agree. Also that gold on the belt looks really awesome. Maybe you could add in a few more subtle gold highlights on the other hooks/buckles/whatever they are. This version so far is really great though.

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Old 07-05-2010, 09:15 PM   #26
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Quote:
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Hey j7, I didn't realize you added this to a thread. I'll put further comments here instead of PMs.
Aye, I opened it up after a certain stage...

yeah, I noticed that too, and mentioned in a PM:

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrob41 View Post
One major thing that just jumped out at me, is that the loin cloth (BTW better now that it is red like the mask) passes through the gold ring, and then folds out to the sides, but you've still got those side cloths coloured black. Perhaps you want them to be red on one side, and black on the other? If so, you might want to put hints of the other colour on each part, so that it looks like part of the back side can be seen along the edge. For example, have the bottom edge of the black fold over and show a bit of red. Hmm , I might not be making this any clearer.

Or, maybe you'll want to make the side cloth red to match the loin cloth? Either way, pay special attention to the middle part of the mirrored loin cloth, as there should be some space there, since the loin cloth is technically two pieces of cloth hanging side by side.
I was both aware of it, and understand what you mean, I'm doing several different versions people will be able to choose from depending on personal preferance, so see below to one solution to that particular problem...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Seikan View Post
Also, the red line on the middle of the mask seems weird, you should make it as the other red parts.
See below to possible solution, although partly it's bioware's fault they've done a few funny things with the mask...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dak Drexl View Post
Totally agree. Also that gold on the belt looks really awesome. Maybe you could add in a few more subtle gold highlights on the other hooks/buckles/whatever they are. This version so far is really great though.
Done...






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Old 07-05-2010, 09:25 PM   #27
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Quote:
See below to possible solution, although partly it's bioware's fault they've done a few funny things with the mask...
Ah, I see, Bioware strikes again!

I like the new version, with the side clothes red, it looks nice.

Also, I don't know if it's because of the screens, or if it's like this in game too, but in the small screens, we can only see the red parts of the mask, and the rest is too dark. If in game it's clearly visible, then I guess, i don't see anything that *needs* to be improved, if it looks the same in game, you should make it lighter.


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Old 07-05-2010, 09:30 PM   #28
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Quote:
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Ah, I see, Bioware strikes again!

I like the new version, with the side clothes red, it looks nice.

Also, I don't know if it's because of the screens, or if it's like this in game too, but in the small screens, we can only see the red parts of the mask, and the rest is too dark. If in game it's clearly visible, then I guess, i don't see anything that *needs* to be improved, if it looks the same in game, you should make it lighter.
It's more the alpha channels to be honest, they're not needed on the mask, and the mask itself looks much better without them...



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Old 07-05-2010, 10:17 PM   #29
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Will this work Sithspecter's Flowing Revan's Robes mod?




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Old 07-05-2010, 10:29 PM   #30
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Its only a reskin it shouldn't affect that mod at all.


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Old 07-06-2010, 06:39 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sith Holocron View Post
Will this work Sithspecter's Flowing Revan's Robes mod?
All of the above are used with Sithspecters mod, so the skin is on his Flowing Revans model, the only thing to note is that for a skin to work with Sithspectre's mod it has to be called "pmbj01" (not N_Revanrobe01). This is because he embedded the texture within his model...



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Old 07-06-2010, 08:01 AM   #32
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Oh, it will have compatibility issues with my mod then °° since it use the pmbj model >.< (and pmbj01 texture)
(And I already posted it, so I guess I will have to post a patch °°)


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Old 07-06-2010, 08:42 AM   #33
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I think it would be nice if the red armour on the chest would have more etched details.
It's sort of empty, I think it would a nice little extra. And to really make it look unique.

Not sure what needs to be done, just swirling lines? I guess something simplistic. Cause its only a small area of the texture itself.
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Old 07-06-2010, 09:43 AM   #34
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Quote:
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I think it would be nice if the red armour on the chest would have more etched details.
It's sort of empty, I think it would a nice little extra. And to really make it look unique.

Not sure what needs to be done, just swirling lines? I guess something simplistic. Cause its only a small area of the texture itself.
I had kind of attempted to already put an "etched" look in, but clearly wasn't too successful It also depends on the particular type of etching you mean, swirly etching is typically the type of etching used on a Samurai blade which will give the wave like effect along the blade. Although Samurai also often had messages etched onto their weapons too, so you also see japanese etched in black onto the blade. European etching tends to be alot more decorative with patterns or pictures on the armour.

Had a little unsuccessful play for the past 30 mins, perhaps if you could find some good samples we can have a further look at some form of etching on the chest plate

Edit: Had a play and here are attempts 1 and 2 at etching...



Edit:

Japanese Dragon etching...




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Last edited by jonathan7; 07-06-2010 at 11:55 AM.
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Old 07-06-2010, 03:25 PM   #35
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Mmmm, the difficult thing here is it should sort of "pop-out", but not look photoshopped to much

I guess I was more thinking on European style, decorative to the max!
Still, it's not something you have to do; all by all, the texture isn't 4096x4096pix.
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Old 07-06-2010, 07:44 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quanon View Post
I think it would be nice if the red armour on the chest would have more etched details.
It's sort of empty, I think it would a nice little extra. And to really make it look unique.

Not sure what needs to be done, just swirling lines? I guess something simplistic. Cause its only a small area of the texture itself.
Are you thinking of this kind of detail? (the horses & griffins on Maximus' chest plate)

or something like these?
http://www.livesteelarmor.com/tech/bur.html

Or something more stylized like the swirls on Lucien Draay's armour/robes?
Show spoiler


In all these cases, the details are raised or embossed so that they throw a bit of shadow. Plus they are higher contrast simply because they are a different colour than the armour plate.

j7, I don't think that kind of detail would be necessary, but it sure would look cool. I guess it all depends on what you're trying to portray... is Revan's armour more functional or fancy detailed?



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Old 07-06-2010, 10:22 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quanon View Post
Mmmm, the difficult thing here is it should sort of "pop-out", but not look photoshopped to much

I guess I was more thinking on European style, decorative to the max!
Still, it's not something you have to do; all by all, the texture isn't 4096x4096pix.
I think unfortunately due to the workings, something highly elaborate isn't possible

Quote:
Originally Posted by redrob41 View Post
j7, I don't think that kind of detail would be necessary, but it sure would look cool. I guess it all depends on what you're trying to portray... is Revan's armour more functional or fancy detailed?
Well, for me I've always though of Revans armour as a psychological weapon over anything else, it, at least seems to me isn't the most practical of armours. However I was aiming to give different people the kind of armour they would like their Revan to wear so have tryed at least to give a bit of variation...

As follows... (56K Beware!)

Show spoiler



"Love is the only reality and it is not a mere sentiment. It is the ultimate truth that lies at the heart of creation." - Rabindranath Tagore

"Many a doctrine is like a window pane. We see truth through it but it divides us from truth." - Kahlil Gibran
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Old 07-07-2010, 06:52 AM   #38
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HOLY &%$#!

No, really, that is awesome. Your first attempts at this robe had amazing detail and now you're really using color to add some amazing dimensions. This gets a permanent spot in my override if and/or when it comes out.


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Old 07-07-2010, 03:19 PM   #39
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Great stuff J7!
Now this is modding, multiple choices

I certainly lovey the one with the extra "bling".
My etched Q version... is a bit impossible

Though it's still cool ^_^

@RedRob: I was more aiming at the 17th- and 18th century fancy armours. I had fat big book about such armours; think from the Spanish kingdom, mainly the armours worn by the royalty. Very decorative, but not something to wear when you go to war.

And Revan was a bit of a fighter. So perhaps the normal armour works best.
Darth Vader wasn't fancy dressed either
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Old 07-07-2010, 10:59 PM   #40
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Just plain awesome man. No more critiques here.

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