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Old 06-21-2010, 02:13 PM   #1
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Curse of Monkey Island: Special Edition

I would kill someone to see this made!

Seriously, we wants it, we needs it!


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Old 06-21-2010, 05:18 PM   #2
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What would you suggest needs to be improved in CMI?

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Old 06-21-2010, 05:33 PM   #3
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An HD widescreen version of CMI + missing scenes and puzzles + Better ending.
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Old 06-21-2010, 05:37 PM   #4
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I would pay money to see the cutscene that was originally supposed to play at the start of CMI Part VI. Fully animated and voiced, it would be pretty awesome.

However, I'll believe in a new Special Edition only when I see it. I don't fully trust the new management people in charge at LucasArts quite yet.


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Old 06-21-2010, 05:44 PM   #5
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I think I'd be pretty much 100% happy with the original art re-scanned in HD and the audio given higher fidelity. With that said, I replayed CMI on my 42-inch TV recently and it looked great with ScummVM's mild filtering.

I can't see it working in widescreen as all the art was made specifically for non-widescreen, and they can't pull the same removing-the-interface trick they did with MI1 and MI2.


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Old 06-21-2010, 05:48 PM   #6
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They recreated all of SMI and MI2's backgrounds and you're telling be widescreen CMI can't be done?
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Old 06-21-2010, 05:57 PM   #7
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I think the main problem will be colorization, since the background-drawings were colorized in Photoshop and not at HD-res. So it's not possible to get higher resolution out of those (even if the PSD-files still exist). And without Bill Tiller and Bill Eaken involved, I don't think a complete redo of that would look acceptable.

Of course, Bill was able to provide me with the Photoshop-file of his cover painting, so who knows what else he has lying around on his old hard drives.

Although: Looking at the backgrounds for "Vampyre Story" and "Ghost Pirates", Bill has gotten so much better. A redo of the CMI-backgrounds by him at that level would, of course, be outstanding (and, sadly, out of question as well).

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They recreated all of SMI and MI2's backgrounds and you're telling be widescreen CMI can't be done?
The backgrounds from MI1 and MI2 gave a lot of freedom, because they were so low-res, so painting bigger version of them was somewhat doable. Tiller's style on the other hand is so distinct, and the backgrounds of CMI are high-res enough to not leave any room for interpretation. Of course, Purcell and Chan had a distinct style as well, but with the MI-SEs showing such a difference in resolution, it's somehow justified... the step from 640x480 to HD on the other hand isn't that big.


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Old 06-21-2010, 06:12 PM   #8
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They recreated all of SMI and MI2's backgrounds and you're telling be widescreen CMI can't be done?
Yeah but don't forget MI1 and MI2 already had pretty much widescreen backgrounds, because a lot of the screen was taken up by the inventory bar.

CMI isn't remotely widescreen so all the art would need to be completely redone (not just elaborately traced) and the scenes all expanded to take up more room, which would mean the original game couldn't run underneath.


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Old 06-21-2010, 06:22 PM   #9
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I hope we can all agree that a changing of CMI's graphical style to match the previous SEs (or, indeed, to anything else) would be sacrilege?

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Old 06-21-2010, 06:28 PM   #10
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I hope we can all agree that a changing of CMI's graphical style to match the previous SEs (or, indeed, to anything else) would be sacrilege?
Absolutely.

Even though CMI got criticised a lot for going another direction with its art style, I've always loved it. And now that I think of it, it's VERY strange that an artist's style can be established so firmly with only one single game. Or are there any other games besides "Vampyre Story" and "Ghost Pirates" that have the distinct "Tiller Look" to them? Or am I going too far calling it that, and others have used that style as well?

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Old 06-21-2010, 07:06 PM   #11
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Well, I would love to see this in 1080p with HD sound. Would look so awesome on my tv.

But I'm sure this will be made eventually, seeing as SoMI: SE was a success and MI2: LR will be a success, It's just when will this be made?


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Old 06-21-2010, 09:37 PM   #12
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As has been said, CMI has aged so well, even from a technical standpoint, that the only way you can really enhance it is by converting it to HD, de-compressing the sound, and maybe attempt to restore the lengthier climax that had to be cut down as a bonus feature. For people like us it would be worth it, but I'm not sure that LEC could justify an entire Special Edition for CMI which, in a testament to its greatness, probably wouldn't look or play a whole lot differently if made today. To the extent that the SE treatments are good ideas, they make more sense for the older games that predated voice acting and reasonably high resolution backgrounds, and I'd be okay with LEC not being able to do any or many more SEs provided they at least re-release all the other games for modern operating systems.

That said, if LEC was to go forward to with an effort to bring the existing CMI artwork to high def, that would be awesome and I'd flip out over it, and I bet Bill Tiller and Larry Ahern would pitch in if asked.

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But I'm sure this will be made eventually, seeing as SoMI: SE was a success and MI2: LR will be a success, It's just when will this be made?
I'm not so sure. I'd say it's more likely we get something like a Maniac Mansion special edition, or, far better yet, a new game altogether from this team. Also, am I the only one thinking that MI2:SE being about done makes this a good time for LEC to release a retail compilation of all the Monkey Island games?

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Old 06-22-2010, 07:30 AM   #13
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Compilation would be sweet!


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Old 06-22-2010, 09:17 AM   #14
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billtiller I put in a request to redo the art for a special edition of
CMI to the producer in charge a few days ago. No reply yet. I'll keep you posted

http://twitter.com/billtiller
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:06 AM   #15
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Very cool! If Tiller is willing to redraw it that'd be fantastic, though as I say they'd have a tough job getting the original game to run transparently underneath. I wouldn't mind just not having the original version there though and them modifying the scenes somewhat to work in widescreen, after all as Jason says the original isn't that different to how a SE would look.

And if Tiller got to revisit all the art it'd presumably look amazing. I'd trust him to modify it to work in widescreen gracefully.


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Old 06-22-2010, 10:59 AM   #16
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I just visited his Twitter page and he just replied, this is what he had to say:

The art for CMI was painted PS at 640x480. So you can't rescan it to make it bigger. But the line work was pencil drawn and could be.

There is hope afterall brethren!


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Old 06-22-2010, 11:28 AM   #17
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I would pay money to see the cutscene that was originally supposed to play at the start of CMI Part VI. Fully animated and voiced, it would be pretty awesome.

However, I'll believe in a new Special Edition only when I see it. I don't fully trust the new management people in charge at LucasArts quite yet.
What cutscene are you talking about? Is there somewhere I can read about this cut scene.
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:56 AM   #18
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What cutscene are you talking about? Is there somewhere I can read about this cut scene.
Here's the section from the CMI Strategy Guide which shows off storyboards for the scene in question.

Basically what happened was:

LeChuck, accompanied by his skeleton guards, is about to put Elaine on his Rollercoaster of Death, which would culminate in her being transformed into his undead demon bride. Suddenly Guybrush shows up, now free of the voodoo curse he was under in Part V, and calls out to Elaine.

This distracts LeChuck long enough for Elaine to grab his sword and start swordfighting the skeletons who are guarding her. But as Elaine forces the skeletons back, their retreat knocks Guybrush into a rollercoaster car.

The car, with Guybrush in it, sets off on its journey toward the maw of Big Whoop. But Elaine, thinking quickly, shoots the lever that controls the ride, and diverts Guybrush's car onto a different loop of track, so it travels endlessly through a series of dioramas.

I believe the audio for this scene was recorded, but the animation was never completed. The Elaine vs. Skeletons swordfighting animations in particular proved quite tricky.

It eventually came down to a choice between including this scene or the shipwreck scene at the beginning of Part IV, and the team chose to focus on that one. So the events of this missing scene were briefly summarized in a couple of dialogue lines, recorded later in pick-up sessions, that LeChuck speaks in the final game.


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Old 06-22-2010, 01:38 PM   #19
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Classic video game company logic - "Put the time and the effort into the cutscene at the start of the game - more people will see it! We don't need an ending."

*sigh*


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Old 06-22-2010, 03:38 PM   #20
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It's funny, because it took me about a year to work out that there was more introduction video after the credits... if you skip the credits then it takes you straight onto walking up in Wally's hold.

I'm reminded of the Simon The Sorcerer opening... the credits are first there as well (like in an old film, though in CMI's case the credits are both at the start and the end), but if you skip them it takes you to the introduction cutscene, not just the start of the game.

If you do watch the credits, Simon comments on you: "I'm surprised you've watched this far...! I would have skipped through by now"
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:21 PM   #21
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It's funny, because it took me about a year to work out that there was more introduction video after the credits... if you skip the credits then it takes you straight onto walking up in Wally's hold.
Really? I don't think I've ever done that -- or noticed it, at least. What do you see post-credits that you miss if you'd played all the way through?

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Old 06-22-2010, 06:57 PM   #22
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Really? I don't think I've ever done that -- or noticed it, at least. What do you see post-credits that you miss if you'd played all the way through?
Well, you'll miss Guybrush being captured by LeChuck and getting thrown into the brig.

So, skipping it might make for a VERY confusing start into the game.

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Old 06-22-2010, 07:33 PM   #23
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Bit of an oversight of the developers! Not many people like sitting through credits.

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Old 06-22-2010, 07:36 PM   #24
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Bit of an oversight of the developers! Not many people like sitting through credits.
Yeah, I agree. You should be able to skip the credits without missing the cutscene.

Ah well. Maybe that's just how they force people to watch the credits. Haha.


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Old 06-22-2010, 07:42 PM   #25
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Yeah, I agree. You should be able to skip the credits without missing the cutscene.

Ah well. Maybe that's just how they force people to watch the credits. Haha.
IIRC, the credits backgrounds are hard-coded into the opening cutscene! The actual credits text is superimposed over the video feed, but the backgrounds, music, etc play as part of the introduction video file. Thus, you CAN'T skip the credits without skipping the entire intro movie.


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Old 06-22-2010, 08:00 PM   #26
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IIRC, the credits backgrounds are hard-coded into the opening cutscene! The actual credits text is superimposed over the video feed, but the backgrounds, music, etc play as part of the introduction video file. Thus, you CAN'T skip the credits without skipping the entire intro movie.
Ahh, I see. Thanks for explaining it.


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Old 06-22-2010, 08:56 PM   #27
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Don't forget that in addition to the scrapped rollercoaster cutscene was the wedding song, performed by Guybrush and Elaine, that was supposed to play during the ending credits. They didn't record the song, but like some of the storyboards for the scene of Elaine swordfighting a skeletal horde, Chuck Jordan's lyrics for "Plank of Love" can be found in the hint book. I always assumed that it was just meant to be background music for the credits scroll, but our interview with Bill Tiller about Ghost Pirates a few months back (still offline, unfortunately), suggests that it definitely had visual elements:

Same thing happened when I was on Curse of Monkey Island. We wanted another few months to get the final cut scene done, a big dance number on the yard arms of a pirate ship. Unfortunately, we ran out of time. But that is the reality of the game business, a reality I am still struggling with a bit.

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Classic video game company logic - "Put the time and the effort into the cutscene at the start of the game - more people will see it! We don't need an ending."

*sigh*
The shipwreck on Blood Island does not occur at the start of the game... Also, the rationale for cutting down the ending sounds way less cynical when you hear Ackley tell it:

You have to make choices when you’re making the game. Early on we decided the most important part of a game is the game, not the video. I’ve seen plenty of games with exceedingly expensive cut-scenes where the game was shallow and/or poorly made. On those games it’s obvious they focused on the cut-scenes first and game play second. When they ran out of time and money, they cut the game.

We did the game first and cut-scenes second. Let me assure you the final cut-scene was designed to be huge and spectacular with Elaine single-handedly defeating an army of skeletons. But, probably due to just HOW spectacular it was gonna be, there just wasn’t time to get it into the game. But if the worst complaint people have about the game is, “this one cut-scene was too short” I can live with that.


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Bit of an oversight of the developers! Not many people like sitting through credits.
I don't think it was an "oversight" so much as a technical issue - my guess was always that they had to use INSANE for the opening credits specifically to achieve that visual gag where LeChuck swipes away the final title card with Ahern and Ackley's names on it with his cutlass. I bet it at least had something to do with why everything up the scene with Wally below deck was handled as one giant cutscene, anyway.

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Old 06-23-2010, 06:53 AM   #28
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It's funny, because it took me about a year to work out that there was more introduction video after the credits... if you skip the credits then it takes you straight onto walking up in Wally's hold.
Haha I was the same, except it was more like five years later (after giving it a third or fourth play). I was pretty much blown away by the fact there was this long, awesome cutscene with superb renditions of the LeChuck music, etc.


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Old 06-23-2010, 09:16 AM   #29
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Wow, Thrik. You of all people, I'm surprised! Because I know for a fact that the first time I played CMI, which was pretty much release-day, I physically couldn't skip the credits due to the awesome rendition of the Monkey Island theme that was playing


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Old 06-23-2010, 09:48 AM   #30
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Haha, well I was like 10 to be fair and I'd downloaded the music by itself from what I recall to enjoy at my leisure!

Since then I've religiously let all intros play through.


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Old 06-23-2010, 03:23 PM   #31
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They also could fix up the animation a bit. It was pretty bad at some points.
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Old 06-23-2010, 03:40 PM   #32
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They also could fix up the animation a bit. It was pretty bad at some points.
Yeah, I agree. We've come a long way in that department since '95, haha.


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Old 06-23-2010, 05:17 PM   #33
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No.

It's fine as it is.


They'd proably want to redesign/re-imagine it if they decide to make a special edition. That would be a shame.

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Old 06-23-2010, 05:50 PM   #34
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Actually, I'd like to see more of a re-release than a special edition. Just like... touch it up a bit, add in the missing cutscene, and make it available to computers from this decade. People would buy that. I would.


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Old 06-23-2010, 05:51 PM   #35
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I'm talking mainly about the cutscenes. It's be nice to get some former Disney animators to reanimate the cutscenes using the original key drawings.


Compare this:
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To this:
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Old 06-23-2010, 08:36 PM   #36
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I feel they could have found a technical solution to the "skipping the intro sequence" problem. I'm shocked that a lot of people were probably utterly confused by finding themselves in LeChuck's hold with no explanation.

MM: I never had any issues with CMI's cut-scenes before, but that Road to El Dorado scene is really a ton better. Wow!

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Old 06-24-2010, 12:39 AM   #37
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If they did a special edition of CMI, I wouldn't want any drastic changes. If Bill Tiller is willing to re-scan and re-color the line art so it looks good at a higher resolution, that's fine. And I wouldn't mind if they re-edited some of the dialogue. There are a few times in the game (which I can't think of specifically) where there's some awkward pauses between lines, which I assume was probably due to limitations in the software at the time. And wouldn't it be nice if Lucasarts released a soundtrack CD? I realize that there are numerous ways to get most of the music for free, but I don't believe any of the released versions of the soundtrack have the music from the FMV cutscenes sans dialogue. I could be wrong, though. Laserschwert?


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Old 06-24-2010, 04:27 AM   #38
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Ooh, another thing:

I want LucasArts to record and add in that song between Guybrush and Elaine ("Plank of Love" or something...) that was going to go into one of the older games but they ran out of time to put it in. I really wanna hear it, haha.


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Old 06-24-2010, 05:31 AM   #39
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MM: I never had any issues with CMI's cut-scenes before, but that Road to El Dorado scene is really a ton better. Wow!
It's just something to consider for special edition treatment. Since there's no need to record the voices. That time, money, and effort could be put towards the cutscenes.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:51 AM   #40
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And wouldn't it be nice if Lucasarts released a soundtrack CD?
It would. High quality music w/o sound FX!!! *sigh*

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I realize that there are numerous ways to get most of the music for free, but I don't believe any of the released versions of the soundtrack have the music from the FMV cutscenes sans dialogue. I could be wrong, though.
No, it's simply not possible to get the music without dialogue and sound effects. Some cutscenes are useable though, like the just-married ending.


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