lfnetwork.com mark read register faq members calendar

Thread: Fear of Law Enforcement
Thread Tools Display Modes
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Old 07-13-2010, 07:34 PM   #1
True_Avery
Banned
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 2,002
Fear of Law Enforcement

I guess this could more be considered a blog post, but I'd like some feedback:

To put it bluntly, I have a fear of Police Officers. To put it less bluntly, I am very uncomfortable with them in nearly any context.

This is unusual for me. Usually when I fear or don't understand something I will try to research the subject so that I may better understand it and move on, but this is something that has bothered me ever since I was a child. In fact, I can remember the exact moment I grew to fear them:

I was walking with my mother to or back from a store and noticed an older Police Officer sitting against his car and smoking. This fascinated me, even at the age of around 5 or less. I had been shown all my life till then that the Police were there to do good and protect everyone, but I had also been shown that smoking was a bad thing to do. In that short moment I realized what the concept of hypocrisy was... as well as never trusting an Officer since, justified or not.

More than any other news articles, my eyes tend to stick to allegations of Police overextending their hands. A family friend tried for years to get an Officer convicted for brutally beating a friend of his for being out past curfew at a gas station. I know people that have gotten away with drugs, speeding tickets, and tresspassing because they were, or claimed to be, in the military. I know people who have done identical crimes, but the "minority" were treated and convicted far more harshly, and so on and so forth.

Police are not required to use a radar to ticket you, can convict you of felony for filming police brutality since it breaks their "privacy" rights, can legally take and sell whatever they "suspect", can search you and your entire car if they so choose, and, from what I can tell, are allowed to kill/beat pretty much anyone they so choose with little chance of being punished.

They finally issued them tasers to try to quell the amount of trigger happy cops, but that has only made them more abusive of what they have. Do I even need to source the fact that these things are being heavily, heavily abused? I'm sure we've all seen and read plenty of stories/videos of police not only using a taser once (as its intended), but multiple cops using their single tasers multiple times, even on people who are not only on the ground but have also given up. This overuse of a non-fatal weapon has been killing people and helped issue multiple apologies from stations over the years.

In Illinois, Massachusetts and Maryland you can get 15 years in prison for filming police brutality of any kind since they are protected under the all-party-consent laws. Earlier in the year a man, who was speeding, was pulled over for a ticket. The officer pulled him over, then pulled and aimed his gun without warning (which is illegal, by the way) and told the man not to move. The guy put his helmet cam on youtube, and now faces 16 years.

In Texas, they can legally arrest you for drinking in a bar since Texas law counts it as "public". So, they can walk into a bar and arrest anyone who has a drink. Where? Primarily in the gay and Hispanic districts, increasing arrests of gay and Latinos by 150% and lowering the arrests for, well, everyone else.

I could go on and on...

I have an irrational fear of them, so thus my ability to judge and research the subject competently is just shot. I get told by some people that the majority of cops are good, fine people and am reassured on this all the time... but I just have a hard time believing it. I don't trust politicians, so why would I trust a politician with a gun and a "suspicion" based permission system?

Am I the only one, or does anyone else share my unease? Can someone try to rationalize any of this for me? Show me that not all cops are who I think they are?

EDIT: Ah, yeah, thinking about it made me remember that a friend of mine was an abused child of a high ranking police officer. I remember I went over and got back something I had borrowed, and when I left his dad yelled at him since he didn't know I was dropping by and then beat the **** out of him. He was generally an abuse a** and a jerk to me and my mom whenever he had the chance.

Last edited by True_Avery; 07-14-2010 at 12:50 AM.
True_Avery is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-13-2010, 10:12 PM   #2
Totenkopf
English spoken in What
 
Totenkopf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: What?
Posts: 4,787
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Member The Walking Carpets Guild Member Forum Veteran 
Cops are like everyone else in that there are bad ones as well as good ones, w/the latter usually heavily outnumbering the former. This is also true of people in most lines of work. I've got to say, though, that if you've been harboring this fear this long, there's probably little anyone is going to be able to say to disabuse you of that fear/loathing or console you on this subject. Just take it a day at a time and steer clear of breaking any laws. To the degree you witness police abuse, report it. There's little else you, or most people, can do.


Now, I want you to remember that no bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor, dumb bastard die for his country.---Patton

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism.---Teddy Roosevelt

I never forget a face, but in your case I'll make an exception.---Groucho

And if you all get killed, I'll piss on your graves.---Shaman Urdnot

How would you like to own a little bit of my foot in your ass.---Red Foreman
Totenkopf is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-13-2010, 10:44 PM   #3
Ping
Elementary.
 
Ping's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 787
Roleplayer 
TBH, I think True_Avery's fears are well justified. I mean, I personally haven't met nor heard of many "good" cops.


"There is no such thing as coincidence, only inevitability" - xxxHoLiC

"Justice? But I don't serve justice, Watson, I serve the truth." - Sherlock Holmes
Ping is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-13-2010, 11:32 PM   #4
mimartin
TOR ate my KotOR
 
mimartin's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,055
Current Game: TOR/FO:NV
Imperialist Meatbags Guild Officer The Walking Carpets Guild Officer Alderaan News Holopics contributor 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ping View Post
TBH, I think True_Avery's fears are well justified. I mean, I personally haven't met nor heard of many "good" cops.
Just how many bad police officers have you met?

I not overly found of being around anyone carrying a loaded weapon including police officers, but besides that, I do not fear them anymore than anyone else.

In Texas you can be arrest for public intoxication, so you can be arrested for drinking in a bar, however I never seen anyone arrested in a bar unless they were intoxicated to the point of causing a scene.


mimartin is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 12:52 AM   #5
purifier
Forumite
 
purifier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: DisneyLand
Posts: 722
LF Jester 
There are times when one begins to wonder though, especially when you read things like this in the news.....


4 officers indicted in post-Katrina bridge shootings.....
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38228986...ime_and_courts


So I can understand the distrust of police officers that lingers from one individual to the next these days, but as Totenkopf mentioned above, I also believe the good ones outweigh the bad ones, at least in this day and age.


Now my father during the 70's, was a local police officer for a small town down south. He never mentioned any abuse or injustice done by police officers on civilians during that time of his employment for the city. And believe me when I say this, if he had seen anything of that nature, well..he would've told me so at some point in my lifetime. I know this for sure because he's never been one to keep secrets in general, no matter how bad they were.

But of course that doesn't mean something didn't happen when he wasn't around to witness it during those years, but I'm sure he would of heard something sometime later through gossip because people can't simply keep there mouth shut. It's human nature to blab about anything when a story has got plenty of drama in it.


SITH HAPPENS

Last edited by purifier; 07-14-2010 at 01:00 AM. Reason: fixed link
purifier is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 01:54 AM   #6
Tysyacha
One of Thousands
 
Tysyacha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Kirkwall/The Free Marches
Posts: 3,181
Current Game: Dragon Age II
Forum Veteran Roleplayer Contest winner - Fan Fiction 
True_Avery,

I too have a fear of police, but I'm just a little anxious around them, not exactly terrified. Mostly because a) they're holding a gun, b) they use tasers, c) they can kill you, and d) even a traffic ticket can be an intimidating business.

Ever hear of "suicide by cop"? That's why shooting should not be a first resort. Even tasering can kill. I say if someone is UNARMED and s/he flees from the cops, s/he is probably scared out of his/her wits and running for their lives, not just their physical freedom. I don't think that most people think they can outrun the cops, but when people panic, their sense of logic goes out the window. If scared, people can do all sorts of things, and if they only run, that's no reason to go gunning them down. I didn't know that you could go to prison for filming police brutality. You call that justice? I call that ludicrousness & hypocrisy.
Tysyacha is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 01:56 AM   #7
Inyri
The Magical Malefactor
 
Inyri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 2,510
Current Game: Final Fantasy XIV
Veteran Modder Forum Veteran Helpful! Contest winner - Fan Fiction 
I've never heard of that actually happening, but then again I live in Chicago. The only police brutality we hear about is mixed in with the hours and hours and hours of coverage of corruption and Chicago politics.

Inyri is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 02:45 AM   #8
Tommycat
>^..^<
 
Tommycat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,578
Current Game: Real Life 1.0(BETA)
Forum Veteran 
If you only know of bad cops, you don't know many cops. Do you realize how many arrests are made each day without incident? That's why when one cop overextends his/her reach it makes the news. Usually national. They don't report on the officer like the one I met the other day who spent 3 hours in the blistering heat(official temp was 114, but everyone knows our temp is 10 degrees hotter) helping an old woman change her tire(only to find out that her spare was flat, and got her tire fixed then got her replacement on her car). They don't talk about how an officer cooled down a neighbor's domestic dispute, with a level head, and words alone. They don't report the thousands of incidents where a cop was just helpful to another person.

Are there corrupt and or bad cops, sure, anyone denying that is foolish. BUT we do have the public defenders office. And they work VERY hard to make sure you aren't being mistreated by the cops. Even small things like traffic tickets the PD's office does investigations on and looks for ways to keep bad cops in check.

Officer involved shooting requires a LOT of justification. Even the use of their tazer is recorded, documented, and investigated.

You should not fear the cops. They are just people. They eat sammiches and chips and stuff the sammich with chips just like me.


"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." Thomas Jefferson
Tommycat is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 05:52 AM   #9
Darth Avlectus
If Sunday you're free...
 
Darth Avlectus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Why don't you come with me...
Posts: 4,275
Current Game: Poisoning pigeons in the park.
I'm a former "cop hater". And I'm still of the mind they are generally *******s. (Until it's party time then they are just really funny drunks.) I'm not sure I count them as friends. But I'd rather have them out and patrolling than letting certain people roam about.

Through time I have come to understand they're just human beings. Albeit, they are like lawn mowers and you should generally stay out of the way. There are bad ones and there are good ones. I have a few family members and friends who went into law enforcement. (My sister wanting to be in forensics.)

What throws people for a loop: They are trained how to use your own mind against you. Very pointed, very probing. They pry and get information out of you. Their training involves ways in which to psychologically jar suspects into confession. Don't give them a reason. Less said the better. Maybe practice some answers. Keep a cool head, breathe.

Some take it way overboard and try to pressure you into admitting to other things, either irrelevant, or perhaps (regrettably) even things you did not do. With society's "better safe than sorry" mentality, this vindicates officers all the more. Still, if some of you only knew how much worse criminals could be, the you might understand and perhaps appreciate cops and their intensity. You might not. I don't know.

I cannot make anyone see it, but you have to look for yourselves. They deal with BAD remorseless people.

They are "paid to be suspicious" which is an understatement and it doesn't make a whole lot of friends either. I do NOT envy them.

I won't lie, there are more than a few that still just piss me off. I've had a few issues with cops, myself. Ones that refused to leave me alone, others that simply want to believe they are in charge.

They are different from state to state. CA, they are often harsh, but some also not beyond reason. I find some of their ethics to be in question sometimes.
In the midwest out in Missouri are actually a bit more courteous.
Texas I ran into a "boat-fer" out on Lake Meredith. Honorable but definitely down to business.
Got ticketed in NV last year by their HP. It was such a speed trap. But yeah, they caught me. Yeah they profiled me thinking I was a druggie they could get on past record since all I had in the car were dollar tree snacks, some electrical tools, and my Kendo Bokken.

"I've heard it all before, pal."
--Tommy Vercetti

Turns out 40 minutes later of all that staring and watching, finding no discernible record, they had to just give me a ticket and let me go. They weren't rude about it, as some CA officers were known to be. (Surprising considering they are mostly a conservative state). But yeah, they thought they had something.

They don't scare me with all those weapons. Their mind is their most dangerous asset. Once you understand it, it is simpler to navigate. Locked myself out of my car once... if you're a dumbass like that, expect them to tease you a little.

Do they sometimes try sneaky underhanded crap? You bet. Doesn't make them right. The way they figure it is...if the shoe fits. There's people gaming the system. Such a mindset is subjective and judgmental, though. Some of them really let it go to their head. They realize they serve the public trust and have to maintain a rapport with the public.

They look at physical posture and behavior. They watch your eyes. They wear sunglasses so you don't see theirs. I could probably pick them out in plain clothes.

What I can really tell you is they are guardians of a sort. They tend to want to be hero. Familiarity is like family to them. If you happen to take a martial art, chances are you'll inevitably practice with some cops. Martial arts are a form of expression. They tend to want to get to know people they practice with. If you recognize one another you might get to know them as individuals.

They also tend to respect people who can simply act strongly and not be put off by them. Or people who know guns. Some even like older weapons. If you're a swordsman of some competence and are in legal possession, they actually tend to respect that. Their job's roots came from somewhere.

Now, I deplore not only cops, but especially security guards who abuse their power because it makes all law enforcement look bad. They bend, stretch, and even break the law to "enforce it" more often because they don't have conduct procedure nipping at them. Truth is, a good number of them don't even have peace officer licenses. Their badges are shiny ornaments. I bet if you were fairly well read in laws and you were to press them on laws and legal matters, most of them would stall. Seriously. Otherwise some security guards are just simply there.

Matter of fact, a guy I knew in high school I saw in NV last year. He was security guard for a casino and told me also for... shall we call it an "establishment". He was security and going for his Peace Officer license. The reason he was probably hired? He's ****ing HUGE. 6'10" tall (208.3 cm), and from the looks of it ~300 lbs and can move pretty damn fast for his size.

Quote:
Originally Posted by True_Avery View Post
To put it bluntly, I have a fear of Police Officers. To put it less bluntly, I am very uncomfortable with them in nearly any context.
Hope I put it into some perspective above.
Quote:
In fact, I can remember the exact moment I grew to fear them:
*brevity* In that short moment I realized what the concept of hypocrisy was... as well as never trusting an Officer since, justified or not.
Not everybody's experiences are the same. There's hypocrisy in their actions just as it is in everyone else's. The thing that puts people off is they have legal power. But still, even if you do not like them, if you understand their mindset, you can normally avoid their inquiry. Don't draw attention to yourself--that's the one mistake people do. They start acting unusual and that gets their attention.

Sometimes if you're just down to business and don't give them a hard time, you might get off easy.

Quote:
*brevity double standards*
It's an unfortunate reality, yes. Not sure what I can tell you except that familiarity with territory never hurts.

Quote:
Police are not required to use a radar to ticket you,
Though true, if you simply are mutually respectful and ask some questions then sometimes you can talk your way out.

Quote:
can convict you of felony for filming police brutality since it breaks their "privacy" rights,
Am aware that several states have laws prohibiting surveillance of their actions. They cannot reasonably expect privacy in their job because it is a public job. While I am familiar of this law, the context of it frankly sounds ridiculous. Cops and (to a much GREATER degree) attorneys do benefit form it. Still, I can see in a few years that this law may be challenged in the supreme court.

Quote:
can legally take and sell whatever they "suspect", can search you and your entire car if they so choose, and, from what I can tell, are allowed to kill/beat pretty much anyone they so choose with little chance of being punished.
At an extreme, yes. Still, so far as a norm this is not the experience around the country, yet. If I do say so myself, So. Cal stands out from the rest of the country in the regard how it deals with things.

Quote:
They finally issued them tasers to try to quell the amount of trigger happy cops, but that has only made them more abusive of what they have.
Yes, and even though there are guidelines, one of the hardest things to detect about electrical weapons is that they do not normally leave lasting damage at their power levels and are not usually lethal. A common issue is the X-26.

If proof could be made of their abuse with these weapons for accountability sake (which is possible at least without penalty in all but 12 states), they'd be less likely to go off the deep end with them. What they do is cause artificial tension and nerve hyper-firing to build up lactic acid in the body.

What you might look into is said device's output power in Watts, or rather Joules (watt seconds) since it's a pulsed output.
Voltage*Current=Watts;
Voltage*Current " " "
-> average per second= average power output (Joules)
-> peak = peak power ouput (joules)
-> valley = minimum power output (Joules)

Also look into human anatomy and its tolerance for electrical shock. Problem here is we all have differing tolerances. It's rare that a device intended for human contact is overpowered, but if you find otherwise, make it known.

Quote:
I could go on and on...

I have an irrational fear of them,
Not exactly irrational, but maybe you tend to jump to conclusions based on what reports you have seen. Just a suggestion.

Quote:
so thus my ability to judge and research the subject competently is just shot. I get told by some people that the majority of cops are good, fine people and am reassured on this all the time... but I just have a hard time believing it.
Not saying they are your friends or to necessarily trust in them for your best interests, but considering all things...I know you have had some kind of experience in studying criminal behavior. Maybe in your spare time that would be a good place to start? At least understand what they are up against on a daily basis.

Have you even encountered them in a different living setting than your current whereabouts?

Quote:
I don't trust politicians, so why would I trust a politician with a gun and a "suspicion" based permission system?
As I said earlier, their mindset is that of staying a step ahead of people who constantly try to game the system. It's real nice when you're the one dishing it out on a value judgment of "if the shoe fits". When you're on the other side of that, then you start to see how that isn't always a just solution.

Quote:
Am I the only one, or does anyone else share my unease? Can someone try to rationalize any of this for me? Show me that not all cops are who I think they are?
Normally I largely don't respond to large posts like these anymore. Since you are asking from an impressionable point of view, however, and are trying to understand what you have failed to do so in the past, I am trying to impart it as I see it.

Quote:
EDIT: Ah, yeah, thinking about it made me remember that a friend of mine was an abused child of a high ranking police officer. I remember I went over and got back something I had borrowed, and when I left his dad yelled at him since he didn't know I was dropping by and then beat the **** out of him. He was generally an abuse a** and a jerk to me and my mom whenever he had the chance.
Damaging to anyone's point of view to be sure. Not to be rude: Still, even for all your experience, there's much you still have not seen.
Darth Avlectus is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 06:26 AM   #10
Astor
It's Thornhill!
 
Astor's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Warwickshire, UK
Posts: 3,632
Current Game: The Old Republic
LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran Helpful! 
From an obviously foreign point of view, it does seem that the American Police is somewhat 'trigger-happy', although I've never been convinced that is the case - the only time we hear about varying US Police Forces in our media is when something goes wrong (Rodney King, Sheriff Joe, the one who can't take snowballs, etc) so it often seems to many outside of the US that they're predominantly bad.

As for fearing the police, I must admit there are times when I'm not comfortable around Officers. It seems that in the UK, as I've grown up, their general appearance has become more 'serious'. Of course, some of this is in part due to them changing to meet the needs of modern policing, but they can often seem less approachable now they've shook off their 'Dixon of Dock Green' image. They're still courteous, but seeing all of their equipment (which wouldn't have been visible 20 years ago) can be a little off-putting, although I would imagine it could be even more so when the Officer concerned is carrying a firearm.






Astor is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 10:20 AM   #11
SW01
3 Years in the Lurk
 
SW01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Northern Ireland, UK
Posts: 1,075
Current Game: Real Life
I personally have nothing but the utmost respect for the Police here. I have never been uncomfortable around officers themselves but rather uncomfortable in situations that may precipitate their appearance - for example, when officers in body armour carrying automatic weapons are deployed in Belfast, it's more 'do I really want to be here?' than fear/uneasiness around the officers themselves. Though that is most likely to do with my upbringing (police family).

The change in equipment that Astor points out has not been noticeable here. Actually, if anything it has become more 'relaxed' as officers changed from the striking almost military uniform of the Royal Ulster Constabulary to the comparatively laid-back PSNI attire. All of the police I have come across here have been entirely polite, something I return.
SW01 is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 02:00 PM   #12
Liverandbacon
I'm only worth a piano?
 
Liverandbacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 651
Forum Veteran LF Jester Folder extraordinaire 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat View Post
If you only know of bad cops, you don't know many cops. Do you realize how many arrests are made each day without incident? That's why when one cop overextends his/her reach it makes the news. Usually national.
QFT. The very fact that stories of cop abuse are considered sensational enough to make news on the other side of the country, or even overseas, just illustrates how far from the norm they are. If it were anything but an extremely uncommon occurrence, it wouldn't go beyond say, state-level news.

I've met a ton of cops, and I'd say 95% have been good guys, I give them respect, they give me respect. 4% are a bit overzealous or not especially agreeable, and only 1% or less have actually been bad people. Of course, since that's based on a limited, though large, sample size, it's not necessarily representative, but my earlier point seems to bear it out. 1% bad is pretty good running for any profession. If I had a choice between trusting two people who I don't know, one a cop, one an average person, I'd pick the cop.



--Too Dumb to Quit--
Liverandbacon is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 02:59 PM   #13
Pho3nix
#rekt
 
Pho3nix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Nordic Europe
Posts: 3,376
10 year veteran! 
It's a weird thing;

In America it seems like the cops have "too much" power and can do pretty much whatever they want to, while in Europe, specifically the Nordic countries like Norway, Sweden and Finland It's the other way around. There has been loads of legal cases over here with cops being sued by the criminals for allegedly being too hard handed and whatnot -- even though they haven't used any excess force. It's become quite...ridiculous in many ways, mainly because it happens so often. The cops themselves are probably more afraid of lawsuits than getting shot. That said, of course excess police brutality does exist, all kinds of ****ed up things go on behind closed doors, and that will never ever change.

And while I've come to regard to whole police force / system as totalitarian, I'm sure there are plenty of 'good' cops out there as well. It's not the badge, It's the people. I don't feel comfortable with tainting the whole profession because of bad mistakes made by people.

Pho3nix is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 04:04 PM   #14
TriggerGod
Senior Member
 
TriggerGod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: hiding
Posts: 2,415
Helpful! 
I'm personally not a cop-hater, but thats probably due to being raised in a family of law enforcement, (Dad is a cop, one grandfather was in the Navy and the other was a county sheriff in a county near Milwaukee) and I never really understood why many of my friends hated cops. I asked one of them why, and he told me that when he was a little kid (maybe 4 or 5) his dad got pulled over by a cop. Apparently they thought the car would be impounded and their dad taken to jail. That incident made him uneasy around cops, even though we'd always cheer on the cops when we'd watch a high speed chase go down highway 26...

As for my other friends, I didn't ask them, but I kinda assumed they wouldn't like them because everyone kinda supposed we were the 'delinquent group.'
TriggerGod is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 04:34 PM   #15
swphreak
My cabbages!!!
 
swphreak's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,510
10 year veteran! Folder extraordinaire LFN Staff Member Forum Veteran 
I don't have a problem with cops. If I see one, I'll check them out and see who's getting busted, but I don't worry about them. They're here to protect us and keep the dirtbags off the streets.

I'm always having breakfast with cops and firefighters at a local diner each weekend, and they're all good people. They just have hard jobs, and, unfortunately, bad incidents get massive national/international exposure.
swphreak is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-14-2010, 06:29 PM   #16
True_Avery
Banned
 
Status: Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 2,002
Thanks for the responses. My bias, I think at this point, is largely unfair and I may try to look out for any Officers that I could get to know. It probably is more just bad luck on my side that my experience with them has been fairly negative, but I think you all have some good points in that most cases probably go very smoothly. It probably is even a little ungrateful of me.

To frame it a little more psychologically, I am respectful of them for putting their lives on the line to deal with criminals and understand that their demeanor is an important part of what they do. They just... really intimidate the hell out of me; similar to how military men do.

I think its just that I can't read them well. I spend the majority of my days reading people's faces, voices, wording and so on... but I just get this wall when I look their way, as well as a look that they can read me far better then I can them and it creeps me out. While I don't know the full skill of everyone around me, knowing that they could most definitely put me down in a matter of seconds also bothers me. Its this overwhelming feeling of submission that just... bothers me.

Still, that seems largely unfair to them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTA
Normally I largely don't respond to large posts like these anymore. Since you are asking from an impressionable point of view, however, and are trying to understand what you have failed to do so in the past, I am trying to impart it as I see it.
Thanks for going out of your way for my post then, and thanks for the full post. I'll definitely be thinking your points over.

And I'm aware that I have a serious rambling problem in my posts. I'll try to work on that.
True_Avery is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-15-2010, 10:07 PM   #17
Q
The one who knocks
 
Q's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: ABQ
Posts: 6,643
Current Game: Mowing down neos with my M60
LF Jester Forum Veteran Helpful! 
Yup, GTA's post is very insightful, and I agree with his conclusions.

I'll also agree with most of the people in this thread that there are far more good cops than bad ones. The bad ones need to be more actively weeded out, however, because they ruin PR for the rest of them, which can really hamper police work. People need cops who they can trust and, conversely, cops need people to trust them so that they'll be more cooperative when they need them to be.

There's just no room in that relationship for bad cops.


"They should rename the team to the Washington Government Sucks. Put Obama on the helmet. Line the entire walls of the stadium with the actual text of the ACA.
Fix their home team score on the board to the debt clock, they can win every game 17,000,000,000,000 to 24. Losing team gets taxed by the IRS 100%, then droned."
-Toker
Q is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-17-2010, 11:59 PM   #18
Ctrl Alt Del
Uncreative User
 
Ctrl Alt Del's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Posts: 3,814
Current Game: Dishonored
Forum Veteran 
You're lucky you live where you do then, Avery.

Cops here go beyond their knack for brutality. They're also infamous for often meddling with extra-official, and more often than not, illegal business. Distrust for our officers is a common thing here, even if in reality it's unfounded, with more cops being honest fellas rather than undercover criminals.


Inspiration

.Bioshock inspiration.
Ctrl Alt Del is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-18-2010, 12:43 AM   #19
Tysyacha
One of Thousands
 
Tysyacha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Kirkwall/The Free Marches
Posts: 3,181
Current Game: Dragon Age II
Forum Veteran Roleplayer Contest winner - Fan Fiction 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I've heard Brazil is one of the most corrupt countries in the world in terms of politics, police brutality, and the chasm between the haves and the have-nots. Is this true?
Tysyacha is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-18-2010, 02:27 AM   #20
Ctrl Alt Del
Uncreative User
 
Ctrl Alt Del's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Posts: 3,814
Current Game: Dishonored
Forum Veteran 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysyacha View Post
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I've heard Brazil is one of the most corrupt countries in the world in terms of politics, police brutality, and the chasm between the haves and the have-nots. Is this true?
Completely.

Politics is hard to stomach no matter where you are, but it's obscene here. Some laws in that regard have been approved recently, but since legislators are politicians as well... let's say I'm not pumped up for the near future. It's more of a result of a historical process than anything else. Politics have long been understood as a private and not public affair, meant to attend a select few - so much that the lower classes, when presented with some of their basic rights, face it as a favor not as what's due to them. A characteristic shared with many other Latin American countries and one of the most persistent plagues our country has the displeasure of hosting.

I can offer an historical explanation for police behavior too. The Royal Police Academy was created to defend the portuguese - and subsequently brazillian - royalty from the angry, homeless and starving mob of the XIX century. What started on the Empire days continued when the Republic was founded. So, essentialy, that's police job from history's standpoint: protect the wealthy and discipline the poor as much as possible.

Finally there's the enormous gap between the rich and poor. This one has seem som improvement on the last years. President Lula has been most effective on bridging the gap and millions of brazillians made it into the middle class. Still, there's a long way to go to erase this shameful state.


Inspiration

.Bioshock inspiration.
Ctrl Alt Del is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-18-2010, 03:03 PM   #21
Jae Onasi
Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem
 
Jae Onasi's Avatar
 
Status: Super Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,916
Current Game: Guild Wars 2, VtMB, TOR
Alderaan News Holopics contributor Helpful! LucasCast staff Veteran Fan Fic Author 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommycat View Post
If you only know of bad cops, you don't know many cops. Do you realize how many arrests are made each day without incident? That's why when one cop overextends his/her reach it makes the news. Usually national. They don't report on the officer like the one I met the other day who spent 3 hours in the blistering heat(official temp was 114, but everyone knows our temp is 10 degrees hotter) helping an old woman change her tire(only to find out that her spare was flat, and got her tire fixed then got her replacement on her car). They don't talk about how an officer cooled down a neighbor's domestic dispute, with a level head, and words alone. They don't report the thousands of incidents where a cop was just helpful to another person.
There's a study done that when people have a bad customer service experience, they will tell on average 13 people. If they have a good customer service experience, they'll tell at most 1 or 2 others. For every bad experience you hear about, there are hundreds of completely normal interactions that police have with people every day.

The times I've had interactions with police have all been decent or even downright nice, even when it was totally my fault. I've gotten caught speeding a few times, and every cop has been very polite. One night we got a knock on our door, and a policeman was there. My hubby had forgotten to put the brake on the car when he got home late from work one night, and it had rolled out into the street. I went to get my car keys to pull it back into the driveway and set the brake properly. He made sure, since it was dark out, to point out an icy patch on my sidewalk so I didn't slip and fall. He didn't even have to say anything, but he obviously cared about my safety. That incident never made the news.

The times I've had to call 911 for emergencies on the road and for a suicide attempt, the personnel have been extremely professional and very pleasant. In the one suicide attempt, the cop took the time to call me back to tell me that it looked like they got there in time and the person was most likely going to be OK. You have absolutely no idea how incredibly grateful I was to receive that call. I thanked that police department for their professionalism and kindness in an extremely difficult situation. That incident never made the news.

One of the police officers who goes to our church was involved in a shooting. He was chasing a guy who was out of his mind on drugs who was running with a loaded gun towards a large park where 3 different daycares all take children to play. The park was full of kids that day since the weather was nice. The guy refused to stop running, and threatened to shoot the cop and everyone around. The cop had no choice but to shoot the guy when he got a clear shot, because he feared what would happen once the guy reached the area with the kids. The suspect died. That police officer knows he saved a bunch of kids from potential harm, but he still feels horrible at being the one who ended that person's life just the same. My kids were going to one of the daycares that visits that particular park, and we've been to the library on that park more than once. I'm extraordinarily grateful that he was there to protect my kids.

We had to call the cops to my office when one of my patient's 'boyfriends' stood with a fist raised 2 inches from her nose and threatened to beat her up while in my waiting room. I thought for sure this guy was going to beat up his girlfriend up in my office. They arrived quickly and managed to get the guy calmed down and removed from my office in a very timely manner, and they did it professionally and calmly. That incident never made the news.

Cops have to deal with the worst aspects of society and people who are absolute jerks. It is generally a thankless job for them. Are bad things going to happen? Yes, because they deal with a higher average of jerks than most people deal with. However, it doesn't negate the many good things they do on a regular basis, and those things vastly outweigh the bad incidents that unfortunately always get more press.


From MST3K's spoof of "Hercules Unchained"--heard as Roman medic soldiers carry off an unconscious Greek Hercules on a 1950's Army green canvas stretcher: "Hi, we're IX-I-I. Did somebody dial IX-I-I?"

Read The Adventures of Jolee Bindo and see the amazing Peep Surgery
Story WIP: The Dragonfighters
My blog: Confessions of a Geeky Mom--Latest post: Security Alerts!
Love Star Trek AND gaming? Check out Lotus Fleet.

Jae Onasi is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-18-2010, 04:14 PM   #22
Tommycat
>^..^<
 
Tommycat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,578
Current Game: Real Life 1.0(BETA)
Forum Veteran 
I think one of the biggest problems with people's perspective on officers is that the news generally likes sensational events. An officer going out of his way to help someone while a grand gesture on his part, isn't as big as the officer that tases a woman in a car.

And on top of it, they like to push the idea that the police officer abused his power. They don't tell you that the guy they had to beat was fighting them vigorously. Or that the officer in the video had to have his jaw wired because the suspect broke it before the video started. We see "ZOMG that officer just punched that guy." We don't see the officer getting stabbed by that guy and reacting to the wound in a less lethal method than the officer was authorized to do. It's the perception that they can get away with stuff that leads people to believe that they do. They really don't.

Officers can be sued by suspects. ANY abuse of power can lead the officer to a lawsuit. That's why we hear about them. Heck even when an officer DOESN'T abuse their power they get sued. There was a man arrested in my neighborhood. He was swinging a bat at random people. He tried to rob a convenience store with that bat. We saw him, took a picture of him swinging the bat at people. When he was arrested he tried to sue the officers for wrongful arrest. It made the news here. What DIDN'T make the news was the photo of him with the bat in hand, that we gave the officer. NOR the 5 minutes of video that my friend shot of him threatening our lives(I wasn't afraid... I had 2 friends who were there with me, Both bigger than me, and as a backup, a 10GA... yes I lived in a ROUGH neighborhood). BUT the media glommed on to him suing for wrongful arrest. And when his case was lost, nothing was said.


"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." Thomas Jefferson
Tommycat is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Old 07-22-2010, 11:34 PM   #23
jawathehutt
Its 5 o'clock somewhere
 
jawathehutt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,636
Current Game: Age of Empires II
I usually don't have any issues with bigger city cops- they actually have actual laws that really do need enforcing, like murders and robberies and such. Its smaller town town police that are usually the ones who grind my gears. They're the ones who do things things like act like breathalyzer tests can just be given to everyone who walks by or ticket underage drinkers with miniscule BACs because they were walking a trashed friend home. My college for a while had to have classes for students about their rights, because the police were downright out of control. Police have to have a reason to demand a breathalyzer. Walking down the street on a friday or saturday night is not a reason to be breathalyzed. But hey, when youre department is making thousands of dollars a night, who needs rights. And this is only made worse by how its downright dangerous. My college has the mississippi river near it. About three blocks from the bars to be exact. Every year, lone male college students fall in and drown. I've been down there at night, its hard to tell its a river sober, being as drunk as the drowning victems have been, I could see how they fell in. Now, one of the easiest ways to solve this issue is to make sure people arent wandering alone when theyre plastered. The police on the other hand seem to think the best way to reduce drownings is to ticket as many groups of people as they can. I see people all the time at parties refuse to walk an extremely drunk person home because they know if a single cop sees them, theyll get a ticket too. So the person has to stumble whereever they end up alone. What a safe environment. Good thing the police are keeping those college students off the streets and doing things like being noisy in a neighborhood of only noisy college students. And constantly patrolling a safe ride(the local metro has free bus rides from like 8-4 I think) drop offs. Way to promote drunk driving police.



"Everyone that posts here is aware of the game, thanks though." ET
"It is Lucasarts"~ LordJhredmo
jawathehutt is offline   you may: quote & reply,
Post a new thread. Add a reply to this thread. Indicate all threads in this forum as read. Subscribe to this forum. RSS feed: this forum RSS feed: all forums
Go Back   LucasForums > Network > Knights of the Old Republic > Community > Kavar's Corner > Fear of Law Enforcement

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:17 PM.

LFNetwork, LLC ©2002-2011 - All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.