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Old 07-12-2002, 02:35 AM   #121
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Installed 1.04 earlier and just finished a Saber only NF FFA match to 40 kills with four friends. It plays exactly like the U104 mod.

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Old 07-12-2002, 02:43 AM   #122
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Where's the damn server updates? Anyone?


<System Lords> | OC-3
66.98.176.218:29070 - Saber only, increased saber damage, reduced blocking, custom map rotation and more to come.
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Old 07-12-2002, 02:53 AM   #123
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My very last post on this thread:

http://www.worthplaying.com/article.php?sid=4710
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:09 AM   #124
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Just a friendly suggestion

Don't download the new patch right away. If you weren't around last time you wouldn't know that hardly any servers had it on until a week after it was released causing you to not be able to play in most games.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:16 AM   #125
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good news I'm still the sh!t at JK2, it just takes me longer to kill people now. hehe, j/k

The whiners have gotten their way, it takes way to long to kill the other guy now... many of the assfighters you guys cried about are still some of the better duelists on the net however get used to 5 minute saber fights, lots of kicking, it's really lame, but that's just my IMHO.

I played this one guy who used to own me in 1.03 (mind you he hated "throw whores" and was an anti-assfighter, he just had mad dueling skillz)

Well guess what? I kicked his ass badly in our first attempt at 1.04. It doesn't make me awesome, it's just he can't throw his saber anymore (impeccable throw aim) and since you don't have to worry about having a saber thrown at you if you start combos from out of range, it's just running around like chickens with their heads cut off, fighting with glowsticks, how gay is that?

btw, I won the FFA with 40 kills in 20 minutes, that's actually pretty bad for me. I won all my duels. I'm not saying I'm awesome, just before any of the whiners responds with "Well he's just bitter because they nerfed pull/backsweep" well you're f@@king right I am bitter but at the same time I can win without it. It just makes the game way too much longer and all the good players (myself included) we're literally kicking the sh!t out of the rest of the players.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:17 AM   #126
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Re: Just a friendly suggestion

Quote:
Originally posted by [WHM]Maynard
Don't download the new patch right away. If you weren't around last time you wouldn't know that hardly any servers had it on until a week after it was released causing you to not be able to play in most games.
No problem for me since I run my own server. Already played a few FFA matches with 1.04

Kaan
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:23 AM   #127
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Quote:
Originally posted by technobot
The whiners have gotten their way, it takes way to long to kill the other guy now... many of the assfighters you guys cried about are still some of the better duelists on the net however get used to 5 minute saber fights, lots of kicking, it's really lame, but that's just my IMHO.

btw, I won the FFA with 40 kills in 20 minutes, that's actually pretty bad for me. I won all my duels. I'm not saying I'm awesome, just before any of the whiners responds with "Well he's just bitter because they nerfed pull/backsweep" well you're f@@king right I am bitter but at the same time I can win without it. It just makes the game way too much longer and all the good players (myself included) we're literally kicking the sh!t out of the rest of the players.

Okay, Im curious, so I have to ask...

If saber fights take at least 5 min as you say, how did you get 40 kills in 20 min?

Kaan
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:26 AM   #128
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I dueled two good players, 3 minutes + 4 minutes (7 minutes)

I dueled three sh!tty players, 1 minute + 1 minute + 1.5 minute (we're now at 10.5 minutes)

I had 35 kills in 9.5 minutes, of which about 18 were DFA into the middle of a group, which even I can admit are lucky kills.

It takes too long because on a smaller board, or if it's just one on one in a non duel situation, it's just me and the other guy whacking away with our bat sabers.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:29 AM   #129
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wonder why raven didnt do anything about kicking. maybe they wanted to give something for the cheap players to hold on to. whatever the reason, get ready for tons of kick spammers, which in some ways are worse than anyone who uses backstab tactics. there's some discussion about people being able to counter kicks, maybe thats because they've never played against someone who knows how to get that kick in, no matter how many times you dodge or roll or slash or whatever. a good kicker wont blindly run into you all the time, they'll watch your movements and confuse you, so you roll when they want you to and attack when they want you to, leaving you nice and open for some 3-in-a-row chain kicks.

usually i'd say that raven wouldnt release a patch to solve this kicking stuff, but since they took care of all those extremely cool backstabing techniques, i think there's hope that this game will really be balanced and victories will rely solely on lightsaber skill, a mastery of all the combos you can do with it, and blocking and evading skills.

one question, can you still roll into your opponent, force pull, and trip him/her in this patch?
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:33 AM   #130
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you can pull the guy down, it's just a lot harder. if you played the U104 neo-patch you'll know what I'm talking about. the victim seems to get up a lot faster but that just might be a misconception...
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:38 AM   #131
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shmacdonaldwald, please stfu about kicking


People being bitter about "cheap moves" being pulled on them are the reason why this game has become a "5 minutes-per-kill" newbie joke. So lets say Raven nerfs kick in 1.05, and then what's next? Moves that are more effective than others ARE going to be used, and complaining about them just ruins the community. A FPS game that allegedly takes 5 minutes to the kill is really not worth the money. Sometimes I feel jealous of Warez-kiddies, because they didn't have to pay for this slow game.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:42 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrYepp
shmacdonaldwald, please stfu about kicking


People being bitter about "cheap moves" being pulled on them are the reason why this game has become a "5 minutes-per-kill" newbie joke. So lets say Raven nerfs kick in 1.05, and then what's next? Moves that are more effective than others ARE going to be used, and complaining about them just ruins the community. A FPS game that allegedly takes 5 minutes to the kill is really not worth the money. Sometimes I feel jealous of Warez-kiddies, because they didn't have to pay for this slow game.
That's why saber damage is being increased for jk2++. When people have low damaging sabers, they seek other ways to kill faster, which ends up creating spam. Now, when people have sabers that can actually kill things, there is no need for a DFA, or kick, or any kind of spam.

High damage for all!
(Course now we need it updated for 1.04 but hey )
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:44 AM   #133
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"Karate Knight 2 - Dojo outcast, now with Black Belt upgrade!!!"

Ahem..... It appears I might be proven wrong yet....

I'll just inform you all that a medium backstab now does 10(!) damage if you face your enemy and block. about 40 ish if you happen to have your saber turned off..... Oh, and I blocked a backstab completely if I was standing in the outside of the (now non-turnable) swing.... Good god!!!

ASSFIGHTERS REJOICE! YOU HAVE TO LEARN KICKING SKILLS NOW!!!

*cough* Or real saber skills, though I assume the first....

You have a *very* low chance of knocking someone down from pull/push, and if you do, they'll get up faster as someone already said here.

Alt-fire on repeater and flechette takes 15 ammo, though I think they did all along 1.03. Am I wrong here?

Hmmm... what else.... The stances don't appear changed in any way, except for the backstab and... oh, yeah mid-air lunge is *COMPLETELY* gone as many had already speculated.

No change to blocking, though I'm used to it by now... are you?
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:48 AM   #134
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Thank you MrYepp... I know a lot of you have already played and PLEASE TELL ME WITH TWO GOOD PLAYERS DUELING, ESPECIALLY WITH THROWING DISABLED ON A FFA DUEL, THAT IT DOESN'T TAKE A LONG TIME. Sorry for caps, but you see my point. Don't give me any of this "well you're just playing sh!tty players nonsense", that's the whole point... what I've found is a newbie will charge in at me, and I just side-step and slice him to death a bit at a time, fights over in 1-2 minutes. A GOOD player takes considerbaly longer because he won't run in and I have to pick my spots carefully. Strategic? Kind of. Boring? Definitely. I'm sorry, dueling for 5-10 minutes doesn't give me an adrenaline rush, it hurts my mouse hand

And I agree with MrYepp about kicking... sure it's cheap but a lot of you can't fathom the fact that the majority of the players don't have the time to player for hours at a time, and want to have fun in the 10 - 20 minutes allotted before their wives start screaming at them to fix the deck or mow the damn lawn. I'm not the greatest player but there's tons worse than me and they're going to have an even worse time because in those 20 minutes, they'll get in around 4 duels, and the board is over... this is just my opinion, I don't flame you guys for having yours so don't flame me for having mine.

It's funny, I see everyone saying how great the patch is (I'll agree it fixes certain things) but no one has disagreed that it takes way too long to kill people with the saber. Even the guys I was playing with agreed; we disagreed over pull/backsweep (they hated it, they're entitled to that opinion) but we all thought that in many ways this was a step backwards...

How about this? Changing the damage system to 1.02, or just give all the styles a boost across the board? That might help counter the bat-saber effect...

One of you guys already said it, but the trend for whiners has been: 1.02 = DFA Spammers are Gay! 1.03 = Pull/Backsweep Spammers are Gay! 1.04 = Kick Spammers are Gay! Sorry guys, just for me, 5 minute saber fights = lame.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:54 AM   #135
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I just think manual blocking would be cool. Didn't somebody say something once about there being a +block key you could bind if the server had it enabled?
I think that's the real answer. All the autoblocking basically gives people free skill.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:55 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally posted by cjais
"Karate Knight 2 - Dojo outcast, now with Black Belt upgrade!!!"

Ahem..... It appears I might be proven wrong yet....

I'll just inform you all that a medium backstab now does 10(!) damage if you face your enemy and block. about 40 ish if you happen to have your saber turned off..... Oh, and I blocked a backstab completely if I was standing in the outside of the (now non-turnable) swing.... Good god!!!

ASSFIGHTERS REJOICE! YOU HAVE TO LEARN KICKING SKILLS NOW!!!

*cough* Or real saber skills, though I assume the first....

You have a *very* low chance of knocking someone down from pull/push, and if you do, they'll get up faster as someone already said here.

Alt-fire on repeater and flechette takes 15 ammo, though I think they did all along 1.03. Am I wrong here?

Hmmm... what else.... The stances don't appear changed in any way, except for the backstab and... oh, yeah mid-air lunge is *COMPLETELY* gone as many had already speculated.

No change to blocking, though I'm used to it by now... are you?
The alt fires for repeater and flechette took 25 ammo in 1.03.
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Old 07-12-2002, 03:57 AM   #137
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Hey Flash, I think that's a great idea. I think many of the guys here would agree auto-blocking is part of the problem and not the solution.
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:00 AM   #138
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Zephorath, I already played JK2++ and I do like the new damage system, it gives saberists enough edge vs. gunners, and saber vs. saber is still quick and exciting even with the super-beefed up 1.03 blocking.

For those of you that don't know what I'm talking about, go to www.wdonline.com and check it out. There are a lot of changes, but regarding sabering, It boosted up saber damage so blue is a 2 hit kill, and medium a almost-1-hit kill, and red 1-hit kill. It sounds ridiculous, but after trying it, it's easy to see how it's an improvement.

First off, it will get rid of all those "gun-spammr-l4m3rs-let-us-duel-with-our-1337-glowsticks" people, because a saberist will be able to kill a gunner. The reason why sabers weren't killing gunners in 1.02-1.04 is because it doesnt do enough damage. With the saber, you can deal a hefty amount of damage, but it doesn't do it FAST enough.






base JK2 will always suck
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:09 AM   #139
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Techno,

Maybe this is how Raven envisioned the game?

Maybe they meant for the game that everyone was skilled enough to handle an oncoming saberattack and wanted epic duels like singleplayer? Maybe they really wanted drawn-out duels like in the movies? I dunno..... Raven works in mysterious ways indeed....

I agree that the blocking is a bit over the top, although I think the lower saber damage is the real sinner. Make every hit count, don't introduce more 'em, that's what I say.
More saber damage, no less blocking.

BTW, thanks for correcting me Zephorath, maybe the gunners will appreciate this change? Or maybe they'll just shrug and feel no change at all? I dunno here either, I'm no gunner.
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:09 AM   #140
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It seems that the ass masters are complaining about the removal of the back swing because it increases the length of a duel. This is a valid point and not a whine. People who care about this game and want to see it develop into a solid stable community make constructive criticisms. The problem is that Raven has never done a good job with the light saber's damage. In any Star Wars movie or novel, a hit with a light saber nearly always results in a limb being severed or death. It cuts through metal and, until the New Jedi Order, had no counter in the way of armor. Ass attacks aren't really an answer to the problem and show that Raven doesn't always think clearly about balance issues. 1.03 was never tested conceptually or in multi-player play. If I can kick somebody to death, why would I use a light saber? In fact, why does any Jedi use a light saber? Instead of prolonging the saber fights and make them tedious as some players have indicated already, why not just up the saber damage and make the blocking a little less automatic? Force players to use skill in blocking.

On a related note, it seems that JD II has done very well from a sales point of view. Lucas has hit or miss record with releasing good SW games. I'd hate for Raven and Lucas to drop the ball by not adding on arena expansions and improving the light saber fighting to include more moves and more complexity. I think fans have shown a willingness to support the game by buying it and generating mods for it. I hope that Lucas will show the same dedication and work more deligently to test their patches for balance and playability and to continue with new add-ons.
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:11 AM   #141
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrYepp
Zephorath, I already played JK2++ and I do like the new damage system, it gives saberists enough edge vs. gunners, and saber vs. saber is still quick and exciting even with the super-beefed up 1.03 blocking.

For those of you that don't know what I'm talking about, go to www.wdonline.com and check it out. There are a lot of changes, but regarding sabering, It boosted up saber damage so blue is a 2 hit kill, and medium a almost-1-hit kill, and red 1-hit kill. It sounds ridiculous, but after trying it, it's easy to see how it's an improvement.

First off, it will get rid of all those "gun-spammr-l4m3rs-let-us-duel-with-our-1337-glowsticks" people, because a saberist will be able to kill a gunner. The reason why sabers weren't killing gunners in 1.02-1.04 is because it doesnt do enough damage. With the saber, you can deal a hefty amount of damage, but it doesn't do it FAST enough.






base JK2 will always suck
Nonononono blue is a 3 hit, yellow is 2, and red is supposed to be 1 hit but currently isn't because you need to do an overhead slash where it hits twice to do full damage. We're going to tweak that for sure (I think.)

Go here for the JK2++ forums, all feedback and constructive criticism is welcome.


http://forums.wdonline.com/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=10

Edit: BTW Cjais, yes, gunners pretty much HATED 1.03, and we appreciate the change
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:32 AM   #142
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Quote:
Originally posted by cjais


ASSFIGHTERS REJOICE! YOU HAVE TO LEARN KICKING SKILLS NOW!!!
Actually, it is going to force players to learn the stuff most full Force duel players have been doing for quite some time.

Pull/kick/saber throw combos are very deadly and are very common on FF duel servers.

As one who often more than not, puts his saber away and simply kicks saber-wielding fools to death, I am really trying hard not to laugh when my opponents still cling to the notion that the saber is still a powerful weapon.

With the backstab and air lunge gone, saber fights are now pretty much the standard "step in, side swing, step out, step in side swing, step out, repeat until your blows finally make it past the ridiculous parry/knock away system"

I said this over a month ago and I'll say it again.
You remove or weaken the saber any more by messing with the backstab and you will effectively make it utterly useless other than when thrown.

In v1.03 the backstab was the one fatal equalizer I had to watch out for, now, lol, I just spent the last half hour kicking people to death in duels and never took a single lethal blow from a saber.

I have been an avid kick/combo user since shortly after the v1.03 patch came out, but I know most of you have not.

You guys got a lot of catching up to do...
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:41 AM   #143
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Hmmmm..... \me reads Ewok's sound arguments.....

Guess I'll stick to Nf duels like I used to....
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Old 07-12-2002, 04:50 AM   #144
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if all you guys do is complain, why play the damn game ! If its not one thing its another. No matter what is done people will find ways to exploit the game. I mean **** the patch has been out for 4 hours and the majority of the posts here are against the patch. Just one question are you as unhappy about your situation in real life to make you this bitter about a game?

LOL j/k all I like the patch, just remember that there will probably be antoher one or two or they may come out with an expansion that updates alot of stuff so just have fun playin thats what I do
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:00 AM   #145
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I'm not trying to be a jerk, it's just I knew this would happen.

It's not difficult to adapt to v1.04, actually for me I don't have to adapt at all. Not one bit.
I only used the backstab as a counter attack or finisher on inexperienced opponents.

It's just become funny that now, I really have nothing to fear from my opponents.
I damn near never died from standard saber swings due to the slow speed or weak damage ratios. Oh, and that lovely parry/knock away system that kept me alive when my opponent had a clean shot that should of landed.

Damn near never been killed from a DFA or Yellow finisher due to my rabid attention to pull+kicking them every time they try one.

Force lightning? Lol, I have been playing since the day this game came out and have been killed 2-3 times by lightning if even that.

Uh-oh better watch out for that Force grip... Lol.

The irony of all this is remember that poll on jediknightii.net a few days after the game fist came out?
It asked what your favorite pert of the game was.
The saber won by overwhelming results.
And now it has been reduced to semi-effective 20 to 30 damage, more often blocked than not, joke.

One other thing, mark my word; you are going to see a Hell of a lot more Yellow finisher/Yaw spin scripts now.
Especially on NF duels.
They are common on FF duels and are almost always an instant kill due to the spin part.

Oh well, I'm going back to kick people to death and laugh my furry little ones off when they try, but fail, to kill me with their worthless sabers.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:00 AM   #146
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Thumbs down

Yea, its so funny it sounds like they totally NURFED the saber. They must be smoking crack. A duel should rarely take longer then 2 minutes.

It sounds like the only way to play this game now is on a server running a MOD with increased saber damage. Does JK2++ work with the new patch. I think this MOD and the DUEL_SE once it is compatible with 104 will be the two choices to start with and more will be on the way for sure. I like DUEL_SE cause it allows the server admin to customize everything to do with with saber damage, saber throw, and kick.

Higher saber damage is the way to go for sure. And there was no reason at all to lower backsweep damage THAT MUCH. Just by making it harder to get knock downs and immpossible to spin would have been enough of a nurf without lowering damage at all.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:02 AM   #147
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Hey am I crazy or did kick get nerfed too? I just created a game with a bot in it and I must have kicked him forty times and he didn't die. Is this because of 1.04 or maybe because of that mod on Jahs server, cjais? Wouldn't a mod for 1.03 not work on 1.04?

slacker
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:18 AM   #148
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um where's the sdk? I was going to release my mod today but now I have to update it to 1.04 but I cant find an sdk for it

I already have most of this 1.04 stuff in my mod too except I made it so you can turn the nerfing on or off and set backstab damage to whatever you want.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:20 AM   #149
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Quote:
Originally posted by MediocreSlacker
Hey am I crazy or did kick get nerfed too? I just created a game with a bot in it and I must have kicked him forty times and he didn't die. Is this because of 1.04 or maybe because of that mod on Jahs server, cjais? Wouldn't a mod for 1.03 not work on 1.04?

slacker
It's his mod and the settings he has, vanilla JO kicks are still the same.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:28 AM   #150
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***Attention Linux Admins***



With this new patch also comes a new assets file. called "assets5.pk3"


You will need to patch your windows machine first, and then copy this file to your linux base folder.

Again much like the 1.03 patch would it of killed someone to mention this file specifically in the readme?

I know it states to copy files from patches 1.03 and 1.04, but again would it of killed anyone to just say copy the assets2.pk3 and assets5.pk3 file from your windows machines.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:30 AM   #151
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Quote:
Originally posted by crazyplaya73

Higher saber damage is the way to go for sure.
Absolutely.
The guys I really feel sorry for are the FFA players who prefer sabers over guns. Taking out a guy using Protect with rockets and the repeater secondary fire mode with 20-30 damage saber swings is going to be a challenge to say the least.

Perfect Jedi Outcast = The high saber damage and blocking (or lack of it) found in v1.02 combined with the attack animations and increased collision ratio tweaks done in v1.03.

Hell, keep the parry/knock away crap if you want but at least make the damn things do decent damage when they do connect.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:33 AM   #152
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yeah, you're right, I found the mod and moved it. The kicks are the same. *sigh*

slacker
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:41 AM   #153
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1.04 server count

110 servers and counting!
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:41 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally posted by boba fett c3po
is it just me or is kick overpowered in v1.04
Nope, it only does around 18-20 damage; it just ignores the wonderful auto-blocking that standard saber swings have trouble with.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:44 AM   #155
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looks like repeater and flechette secondary fire take up 15 instead of 25 ammo now. which is good.
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:49 AM   #156
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You know, i was just dueling...and I could still pivot while backstabbing. My opponent used mind tick and appeared behind me, so I used the backstab for its TRUE purpose. I moved the mouse out of curiosity, and I pivoted during the move. Is this common? or am I high?
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:50 AM   #157
C'jais
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I'm just wondering about *one* thing Ewok:

What will your sig be now? Loadsa options mate....
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Old 07-12-2002, 05:51 AM   #158
KnightHawk420
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by boba fett c3po
is it just me or is kick overpowered in v1.04
and you can still use the floatbug
and you can also still pivot while doing one of those special moves
i thought those 2 things were gone in v1.04

You we're playing a 1.04 server without the assets5.pk3 file. Which essentially reverts it back to 1.03..
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Old 07-12-2002, 06:03 AM   #159
Demolisher
 
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Wtf?? I was on the Jedi Academy server, which I'm not even sure is patched, and I kept crashing with these weird client error messages. Raven, this game is so ****ed up; I am so ****ing sick of all this crashing and freezing!!!!
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Old 07-12-2002, 06:09 AM   #160
Grabes
 
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ewoks sig?

He doesn't need a sig, in everyone of his posts he portras himself as a god to JK2, gogta love arrogance. Vanity is sin ewok, there about the same.

BTW, don't reply back to me, i don't care what u say.
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